Great Cars And Trucks; Vehicles For Sale overbilled my credit card and will not provide a refund Calgary Alberta

As a former employee of this company, I had to admit that there were problems with customer service. I did not work at the Edmonton branch but was informed by management that the problems started up there. I talked to dozens of people who claimed that they did not get their money back, though the company guarantees the return of the $159 fee after ninety days. It is in writing and is emailed to the customer or else, faxed. I suggest contacting management, writing to the paper and taking it up with the company. They legally are required to return this money.

As for mentioning various employees, we are instructed not to use our real names. The use of these people's names is erroneous as people rarely last longer than a month and there is no record of employment. People are hired as independent contracters, paid in cash and no record of employment or cheque is issued. We don't have time cards, a calendar or schedule. People work when they want, on commission and receive a substantial portion of the fees collected as soon as the car goes up on the web site. The money is kept whether or not the car sells. Few people are able to sell (I have talked to many angry customers on the phone complaining about this company and cynical about their business practices and many had signed up or been called already). People come and go. There is no steady income in this business.

I suggest complaining to the federal and provincial or state ethics committee on business, checking on their federal registration and looking into their business practices. A lawyer may be able to help get a collective settlement. I suggest this because there are so many reports here it is hard to ignore. Great Cars and Trucks boasts a ninety-three percent success rate but so many people haven't sold I doubt it as well as their promotional techniques, marketing strategies, claims of pre-financed, pre-approved buyers. As for callbacks, this may be an oversight, people quitting and moving on, poor organization, busyness, or that the management doesn't approve of callbacks.

Great Cars and Trucks won't stop calling me!
They: 204-480-7600

I keep calling and asking to have my number removed from their list, and they keep calling.

I have finally filed a registered complaint with the FTC, and I hope to get somewhere.

Else I get to keep playing with them.
Argh!

-going bonkers in boston

What you are not telling people is that you require a 90 day period of trying to sell a vehicle. If you have not contacted your credit card company before this time it becomes extremly difficult to get your money back from the bank the GCC is using. This is a simple scam. wait 90 days, get evasive, stalling tactics and then lie and have someone swear to it and time passes.

The credit card companies need your responses within a certian time period, they even tell you this when you try for a dispute of charges. Compound this with the fact that this company is out side the borders of the USA and they do not have an attorny general as the USA 50 states have.

You can lie all you want, keep writing rebuttals to keep your company taking money that YOU KNOW WILL NOT BE REFUNDED and have others swear to it. This is a basic, simple transparent scam that the rebuttals must be seen with. Keep writing the rebutals and the rest of you remember that a scam is a scam no matter how well it is being hiden from the obvious.

call your credit card company and notify them about this company. Great cars and trucks broke the promise of selling your vehicle and also the promise to refund the full amount of your money. My credit card company has launched an investigation on great cars and trucks. No matter how long ago it was that you'd paid them, you should do the same.

Wow - I just got a call from GC&T and am happy to say I did NOT take their "deal".

I have been a reader of rip-off for a while but never thought it could save me this soon.
I have read about this company on this and another website - the cost of the ad is not bad, but they shouldn't even bother with the money back guarantee. It was James from this web site that decided me. I would never deal with a company that had men like him representing them. James tries to side-step all of the legitimate issues and either blurs the truth or out and out lies.

I learned early in life that by taking ownership of a problem "I did this with this result", and apologising and/or finding a solution is the answer to most problems.

Consumers use Google and when James pops up ... honestly .. I am a small business owner and James attitude alone could put me out of business.

James, I am aware you will probably call me names and insult my intelligence but you should know the worst publicity your company gets is from YOU.

Thanks Patrick;

Yes in the USA the competition is more fierce. So yes the Trader in the States is only 49 dollars until it sells & you can buy a Trader usually for under a dollar.

Now there is one thing they fail to mention. You have to call them every 2 weeks to "re list" your ad.

In Canada it it different. They charge around $100 for a big color ad & the Trader costs over $4 in the store. Your ad only runs for 2 weeks at that price. They will give you a deal for around $200 though, since GC&T came into business. They now have an ad that will be listed until sold. USA & Canada are the same however with the amount of "dealer ad's" you are mixed into.

There is a 'vast difference" from the Auto Trader in Canada, compared with it's partner in the USA. That is what competition does, & the Auto Trader has much less of that in Canada.

So yep Patrick you do get a better deal in the USA. I will admit that. They are not such a "rip off" there. However us poor "Canucks" have not so many choices.. There is a "good need" here for GC&T.

Still I think GC&T has a place in the USA, as it's only real competition seems to be "Classy" who does what GC&T does, with less vehicles, only US ad's & less financing than GC&T offers.

However for the rest, Classy offers the same.

I hope us "Canucks" are good enough to compete though & I think we can!

James,

I must say, I was quite surprised by your last response. It pleases me that you recognize my reasons for posting on this report.

I would like to correct one misconception if I could. Never have I said that GC&T was a rip-off. I know for a fact that they are a legitimate business, and that people do have success selling their vehicles with them.

My comments basically stemmed from two issues:

1) Concerning Adam's refund for being overcharged for his ad. I know that you were only trying to offer Adam an additional avenue for getting his money back. Unfortunately, we all went off on a tangent on that. However, I think this was resolved to his satisfaction. Adam, please correct me if I am wrong.

2) The whole issue regarding the number of ads on the website. I conceeded that there are well over 50,000 ads listed as you have stated. My only concern was that you were possibly misrepresenting that number to potential clients. As long as it is clarified that some of those numbers are duplicated ads, then all should be well.

As a final comment, I will say that I am most likely going to be selling one of my current vehicles in the near future. Whether or not I will use the services of GC&T is yet to be determined. Just for research purposes, I went to the Auto Trader website to see what their rates were. They offer a 10 week (2.5 months) internet and print magazine ad for $49. For this you will be able to place a picture on the ad, be able to modify the internet ad as needed, and have an email response link. Not bad for the price. Yes, I know. There is no money back guarantee, and they do not have financial services available.

James, I wish you, Craig and GC&T good fortune in the future. All I ask is that you keep the business ethical.

Dear Readers;

I really do not belive that Patrick is any part of "Club Moron:. I just think that he had some questions that "for him" had to be addressed. He was a "hard a*s" & would not give me a break.

However he was a good competitor. I may have "won the arguement"... but I did not fix the problem.

The reason for this website is that people felt they were "ripped off" by GC&T's. They were not.

Patrick went to "bat" & tried to do the "best he could" to either fix the problem, or "show GC&T" as a rip off.

He was not successful, but you have to admire his want to get rid of "unscrupulois" companies.

Patrick did not "wander into this situation". He felt it his duty.

Hail to Patrick, as he almost got me! In another situation I would be glad to have "Patrick" as my defender.

Montgomery never took nothing away from Rommel, & I take nothing back from Patrick!

If it were not for people like him, you would end up with "rip off's" going "unchecked".

So I apologise for everything I have said to Patrick. He is a man checking up on what people do.

Yes my dear Patrick they paid for those extra listings. Do you really think GC&T would pay to have an inputer place those ad's in all the different States if the customer did not pay any extra for it? So what you are saying is, the customer paid what? $100 & it cost GC&T more than that to have the ad inputted?

Give your head a shake Patrick. Or yes "call the customer up" & ask how much they paid.

When you find out that you are wrong about this too, just as you have been wrong about everything else you have accused. When you figure out that I do have good reason to label you "the President" of Club Moron. When you finally see the light, just remember that I told you "in the beginning" the answer to your accusation. Even though you presented it as an accusation instead of a question.

I know the truth because I know of the salespeople who have been told off for charging too little for extra ad's they placed & I know why they were told off.

I know also that you cannot simply "cut & paste" when adding vehicles on the website. Each ad must be entered individually, as that is the way the input program is set up.

You will also find the "same goes" for the duplicate ad's in the Auto Trader or probably all of the other venue's you might check on.

So far, the only "question" you have asked is what my affiliation with GC&T is, as did some other people who were looking for someone to blame for their "non issues" as they turned out to be. It was not "side stepping" anything to be careful about a response to that. I had already responded to it correctly over 1 year ago. Since the question was already answered & had nothing to do with the answers to the problems presented... since my reply's were labeled "Consumer Suggestion", I did not feel the need to repeat myself.

Even though that is what it took, on more than one occasion for you "the President", to finally get it, as you accused me of being a liar.

So "again" as I have said many times before... "Yes Patrick customers must pay for extra listings in other Provinces or States". Just as they do with most other venue's.

I was all set to just let this issue drop, and let you have the last word. But you keep saying things that just have to be addressed.

You would have us believe that every duplicate ad is "paid for" by the person placing the ad. Does that also include the guy in Ohio with the Camaro Z28 for sale that it listed 33 times? If I called him up, would he say he shelled out $3,300 to GC&T for his ads, or will he say he placed one ad, and GC&T took it upon themselves to copy it to other locations?

Or how about all the ads listed under Arizona, but are for sale in Utah? Did all of those people pay to have their ad in more than one place?

C'mon Jimmy, you really don't expect everyone reading this report to believe that, do you? Do I need to call up some of these multiple ads and ask if they paid for a single listing, or a "national ad" as you claim?

Patrick want's me to advise every salesperson to spend the first 2 hours of each working day counting how many duplicate ads are paid for "today" on the site, then hire someone "full time" to call all the customers & find out if their vehicle is sold. Take those numbers, after deductions & quote that number to every potential customer, Isn't that right Patrick?

Well my dear Patrick, as you are the only one concerned with it so far, would you like the job? It really won't pay anything because it does not serve "any real purpose" at all.

Now you can try the Auto Trader maybe. They have an relative amount of duplicates & sold vehicles if you count all their issues. Possibly they will pay you to do it.

They might tell you what I have, that it does not matter to them, as never has a customer ever not listed, or cancelled their ad because of the issue.

You may even get some of your members from "Club Moron" to help you, if you can find a venue who thinks it is enough of an issue to warrant paying for the service.

Just do yourself a favor. When you call these venue's & ask them how many vehicles they have listed, don't begin with calling them a liar. It is not a good way for you to get the job.

David a "paid for" listing is a listing & the amount of people who pay for listings on a site "is relevent".

Also GC&T would not be in business after close to 4 years if they did "double charge". In case you did not know it friend, that is called FRAUD.

However you can stay in your fantacy world if you wish.

So if I only have 300 cabs but I count each cab twice I can have 600 cabs and now I'm the biggest cab co. Duplicate listings still mean duplicate listing.

Guess I'm in the Moron Club too but smart enough not to count things twice. I'm also smart enough not to give you my credit card number since Great Cars duplicates charges too.

Oh well, can't say I didn't try. At least the consumers reading this site will see how ethical you are.

I actually feel sorry for you Jimmy.

Exactly "what is a listing"? I think it to be something listed on a website. I have never been asked "How many individual vehicles in total are listed on GC&T's website?". Never. I doubt any salesperson is ever asked that question either.

A salesperson would tell how many "listings" are on the site "in the beginning". Now if asked if they were individual listings, I would probably think that most salespeople would say that there are duplicates & since that would not be "of real interest" to the customer or the salesperson, neither would know a total to elaborate on. I as a salesperson do not attempt to discuss what I have "no knowledge of". I would need to do a study of them every day to have knowledge of the duplicates. Since their numbers do no affect my presentation, nor are they of interest enough for the customer to ask about, they would not be discussed.

If you owned the "biggest cab company" in town sporting over 500 vehicles, would a customer ask "How many are in the shop? How many are night only vehicles? How many are day only vehicles? How many are 24 hour vehicles? How many drivers do you have?". No! If your competition had 300 cabs & you had 500 cabs, you could confidently say you were the biggest with 500. Anyone like you who would be questioning those numbers as to what was on the road at this moment, would be spouting symantics, just as you are doing with duplicates.

It is not an issue. It never comes up. People look on the website & see how many there are. No one but you counts duplicates. You are the "only one". You are the only one it matters to! You do not have a vehicle on the site Patrick! You have no interest other than stirring up trouble. Period!

I have no idea how many are on the site that are sold, or duplicates, or how many are in the process of going on the site right now. All I know is the truth. There are over 50,000 listings. Listings Patrick... listings!

OK Jimmy, so you went back and referred to a report that has not been posted to since 9/1/04 and pulled out a coomment you made over a year ago. You were forthcoming back then, why not now on this report?

"As I pointed out on my last post & why, your issue with "duplicates" is really a "non issue", as no real "customers" have ever complained about it."

You still don't get it, do you Jimmy? Let me say this nice and clear so that you understand. If a client asks "How many vehicles are currently advertised?" and you answer "Over 50,000", then you are flat out lying to them if you don't mention that a lot of them are duplicates. It does not matter if no customers have complained about it. You are using misleading information to entice people to advertise with GC&T, and that is wrong.

Be a responsible business person. Give potential clients the facts about GC&T instead of smoke and mirrors, and let them decide whether or not advertising with you is a good idea.

Patrick, you sure throw up accusations without any research.

Here is what I posted "over a year ago".

Rebuttal REBUTTAL Consumer Suggestion:
Submitted: 6/24/2004 12:57:00 PM Modified: 6/24/2004 11:00:57 PM

I am honest


To Whom this may Concern:

I have been working with "Great Cars & Trucks" since October of last year.

I have "personally" never lied to anyone! We give a full page & full color ad for 3 months with a "money back" guarantee... "which we honor" if the instructions are followed & we have financing as no other website offers! This disgruntled employee was not one at all but an "independant contractor" as I am & if lieing was done... that was him or her & has nothing to do with the ethics of this company.

James - Calgary, Alberta
Canada

Did you read that Patrick? I quote "independant contractor as I am". Written over 1 year ago. So who is misleading someone? Not I!

As I pointed out on my last post & why, your issue with "duplicates" is really a "non issue", as no real "customers" have ever complained about it.

Find a real issue Patrick. A real issue that makes GC&T a "rip off" or... live up to your promises that we can all "take to the bank".

The banks I know will not accept what you say.

Dawn;

You can argue symantics all you want. Adam was "the first" who claimed he was "overcharged". Again a mistake made by a human & rectified when they got to the issue. I explained to Adam that they had just moved one of their offices & changed phone companies, which put them behind on "customer service". No "side stepping" the issue involved! GC&T corrected the mistake when they finally got through the "piles of calls" from customers all wondering why these things were happening. There were very many of them to go through. In the end "no harm done" as the money was returned before his next statement & it cost him "nothing".

Yes if you are overcharged, you should try to contact the company who did that. No side stepping here! No one said GC&T was not responsible. No side stepping on that either! Giving Adam another way of getting his money back is not a "side step", but a helpful piece of advice. Nomatter how you & your President want to "spin it".

Anyone else who has complained on here about money are people who wanted to get their money back, as GC&T has a "money back guarantee", but did not follow the instructions for doing that. They simply wanted GC&T to believe them that their vehicle did not sell, & they felt they should be able to claim that refund, "any time they pleased" as the only rules they felt they needed to follow were "their own". Upset that GC&T did not agree, they complained on here. I merely pointed out that the proceedure is "not hidden" & clearly outlined on the website. I am "so sorry for them" if they failed to read those instructions. However that is not GC&T's fault. I also pointed out that they had "little to complain about" as what they paid for got them quite a bit more than they would have got at "other venue's".

As far as Patrick goes, He is presently on his 4th or 5th arguement at this point in time. He has gone through all of these issues with me, & now is complaining about "duplicate ads" that people "pay for", because they want their vehicle listed in other States & Provinces.

Now he is "insane enough to think" that GC&T's salespeople should be in the habit of bringing up such "dis advantages", if that is what you call them, to every customer. Well what may be a dis advantage in "his eyes" is an advantage in someone elses, expecially when it is the customer trying to sell their vehicle.

Again, I will repeat. Other venues have duplicate ad's too. If you buy the Auto Trader for Manitoba, you will find Sask vehicles, Ontario vehicles & Alberta ones too in that issue. Customers pay for that! The Auto Trader does not bring that to your attention when you place an ad either! However they will tell you approximately how many ad's they have in their issue & I doubt they will preface it by saying "Now for our ad's that are not duplicates... we have (x number of vehicles listed in Manitoba).

It takes a good "20 min" of a salesperson's time to explain "all the advantages" of GC&T. From the guarantee & where it can be found, to the amount of listings on the site, to the fact that you will not be mixed with "dealer ad's", to the financing, the rates for it & why having financing backing you up is so important.

Then usually the customer needs to "check the site" & the salesman needs to spend more time with them. Those who wish then to check with their friend, or "spot the dog", are usually not worth any more of the salesperson's time. There definately is not the reason to list "possible dis advantages" at this point, as the advantages far out weigh them. Those people looking for problems, as in Patrick's case will find them, nomatter how irrelevant they are in reality.

The salesperson knows how fast these vehicles sell on "other venue's" as they call these other venue's customers on a regular basis! You can be "well assured" that in "most cases" a vehicle will not sell inside of it's first month listed!. Spending money with most "other venue's", would leave you with twice the investment into selling your vehicle, at that point & still "no results". No more ad either unless you spend again! GC&T is a good & viable solution to that problem & try their best to explain to the customer why.

If the customer is concerned about duplicate ad's, they can look for themselves & ask questions of the salesperson about that. Believe me, it is rarely a big issue! If the customer is concerned about the guarantee, they can read it on the website & ask questions of the salesperson about that too. Again, it has never been a "big issue" to anyone reading it first. No salesperson can force a customer to read. They can mention however where it can be found & give the customer the oppertunity to read it. Most salespeople do, as they do not like complaints, & usually do not get them if they mention this up front. This however will not prevent some customers from claiming this was hidden from them. Obviously something that is in the "best interest" of the salesperson to make clear, as they usually do.

However "never" has a customer ever wanted their money back because they were told there were over 50,000 vehicles on the website & they found some "duplicates" on the site! Never has a customer demanded their money back because of a mis spelled word on a "rip off report" about GC&T! In the end, these are simply "non issues".

Now Dawn, I am glad you have chosen a profession & have studied the skills necessary to do that job well. It may be important that "you" do not make spelling mistakes. People in other professions do not & need not live up to those standards! Carpenter's don't need those skills as much as you do & neither do Salespeople. The rip off report has no "spell check", but I would assure you that if I was writing a letter to a customer, or making up a document for them, I would be using a medium for writing it up that had a "spell check feature".

So if anyone at "Club Moron" can come up with a "real issue" that really is a "rip off", as involving GC&T, I welcome the input. However "being true" to your "code of conduct", you still have not presented a "real issue" which is a reason to call GC&T a "rip off". Until you can or do, I advise you all then to buy your "T Shirts" & caps! At least you might keep someone employed doing that! Perhaps you would rather just "get a life".

Possibly you could comment on something that "directly affects you"!

Congratulations Dawn,

You are now an official, card carrying member of Club Moron. Here is your t-shirt, ball cap and laminated membership card. Welcome to the club!

Now Jimmy, I really only have two issues with you. First, you tried to sidestep all questions concerning your affiliation wiith GC&T. Why did you not just come right out and say you were an "Independent Contractor" for them?

Second, you have stated yourself that you are using misleading information when speaking to potential clients by telling them that GC&T has over 50,000 vehicles listed on the site. Yes, if you count them all up, there are over 50,000 listings. The misleading part is that you do not tell them that most of the ads, especially the ones in the US, are duplicates. So you are misrepresenting the true number of ads. That is bad business Jimmy.

Jimmy, you are the personification of a steroetypical used car salesman. Dance around the issues, use misleading information, tell the customer what they want to hear. Avoid the truth at all costs.

Bad bad used car salesman.

You are welcome to your opinion about me James. I have a life. I have 2 kids and a husband, I work and I go to school. But, I also dont like it when someone tries to two step around a legitimate issue. Adam was not the first person to complain about GC&T's ethics. He was just one of them. You seemed to have an excuse everytime and you "mistakenly represent yourself".

How about some accountability. I am glad that Adam got his money back but what about the next person that may or may not get their refund? What about that? Maybe the next time someone is overcharged by this bootleg company you wont jump in and tell them to call their credit card company, maybe you will do whats right and point them in the right direction to get their money back.

Dont knock Patrick for being a consumer advocate that is the purpose of this website to help other consumer know their rights and to protect them from companies like this. You can call it "Club Moron" all you want at the end of the day, he was right and you were wrong. Have a good day !

What do you not understand? Even in the quotes you pointed out I said I was not an employee. I said I made a mistake & labled it wrong. An honest mistake that has nothing to do with anyone trying to sell a vehicle & it does not take away from any of my comments.

You can pick on that & you can pick on spelling. As I have said before, I am not a Journalist. I am a salesman & I do not sell using the pen, but my vocal chords.

Any rebuttal from me should be labled "consumer suggestion" & any that are not are merely mistakes. Get it? Ok let me explain it nice & easy for you. I am not the owner & I am not an employee of GC&T. I never meant to put off as if I was. Either I or the "Rip off Report" mistakenly labled my entries.

Now as for Adam. He tried to contact GC&T & did not get an answer. He tried emails & got nothing that way either. Then he tried calling again & the phone numbers were changed. On another occasion he found the office he was dealing with moved.

That sure is a lot of contacting. Do you not think he had done enough at that point? I did!

So I advised him to contact his credit card company. If he would have done that after the 1'st try or even the 2nd, he probably would have gotten his money back sooner. Instead he became the "energizer bunny" & began then writing rip off reports.

This is when the leader of "Club Moron" stuck his nose into it. I knew GC&T was having a "crisis" right then. I knew that they would not intentionally "rip Adam off" & I gave him good advice that would lessen the amount of work he was doing & make it easier on him.

Shortly after the "leader" of Club Moron began to "pick pick pick", Adam was returned his money. It cost him nothing. My advice was not bad. GC&T did return the money without an issue. Nothing said in the "rip off reports" had a bearing on it either.

So you want a "T Shirt"? Go get one! You definately qualify. To qualify you have to have "no life" & nothing else to do but to find problems. In this case it does not even have to deal with the website. Only errors "apologized for already" by myself & your attempt to "push the envelope" by stating those mistakes actually mean something. They do not. Simply mistakes.

You should ask Patrick if you can be Vice President of "Club Moron", as you have not only passed all the qualifications with flying colors, you have no "real issue" at all!

Please don't "break your mind" presenting an intelligent issue. Be happy in the arms of "Club Moron".

Since I am the only one who had a friend come to me for advice I am going to assume the first part of your Paxil laced response was aimed at me. You have way too many identities going on so dont even bother adding Psychiatrist to the list. That is scary. Its not about mind control and all this other bs you are spewing. Its about customer service. Its about being a professional. I think it should be about spelling too. My job requires I spell 98 percent of my work correctly so pardon my good spelling skills. I get paid for it. And I dont need you to point me to some Oprah watching broad who claims she had such great service. Yeah,I saw her response. It takes a real spine to be a real customer, for all I know she may be the receptionist. If you the owner/employee/consumer with a suggestion cant figure out who you are than no wonder the receptionist is lost. Just admit your company is a joke....

"Sybil" would be jealous.
Just who are you today? James Stewart the owner, James the employee, or are Jim/James with a suggestion? Believing would be so much easier if I could only figure who the heck you are.
I did some research this what I found. Please note I only copied and pasted what I saw and I found a disturbing pattern.

Rebuttal REBUTTAL Owner of company
Submitted: 9/3/2004 8:47:40 PM Modified: 9/4/2004 12:20:46 AM
if you follow the rules properly you can get your money back
This again is James
You had a problem with your ad & so we gave you a free ad & sent you email stating your login name & password. We thought that would help.
James Stewart - Calgary, Alberta
Canada

Rebuttal REBUTTAL employee
Submitted: 9/4/2004 1:20:35 PM Modified: 9/5/2004 10:24:21 AM
As a final word
This is James & I am a "good salesperson". I believe in what I sell. I am not the owner of "Great Cars and Trucks" & I am "not" an employee of this company.
As a "final word" let me say this. I am an "independant contractor" who has been working with this company for close to 1 year.

Yours Truly;

James Stewart. - Calgary, Alberta
Canada

Rebuttal REBUTTAL Individual responds
Submitted: 3/18/2005 3:30:43 AM Modified: 3/18/2005 11:22:37 AM
Rediculous!!
What a pile of crap!
Great Cars and Trucks has a money back guantee. So does Vehicles.com & others.
Jim - Calgary, Alberta
Canada
Am I the only one who remembers the " I am an independent contractor" line?
Would someone please tell me what is going on here? First you were James Stewart owner, then you were James Stewart employee, then you just suddenly became Jim an individual with a response now 4 months later you are James the suggesting consumer. In less than a year you have at least 4 personalities. Patrick was right there is something very wrong and not only that GC&T should require all employees learn how to spell. What kind of salesman make this many typo's? I hope you dont type contracts. This all started because you want to blame the credit card company for a mistake that was clearly GC&T's fault. I remember when I was double charged for something. I simply called the company I was doing business with and they refunded my money, the man was charged three times for something that was manually billed by a human not a machine. He wanted his money back thats all, you tell him to go to Visa? Thats not a good way to do business at all. Patrick figured you out early on and now you want to turn it all around and make him look crazy. I guess Amir, the ex employee who knows you, Wally, Paul and I are losing our minds right? You are welcome to your opinion.
Ok, Patrick pass me my "CLUB MORON" T shirt.

I doubt it was me. However I can understand a salesman's frustration.

You were probably called when you were listed in the Auto Trader.

You were paying what? $100 every 2 weeks to be listed along side 70% dealers? You had no financing backing you up & no guarantee?

So the salesperson called & explained the website to you right? The salesperson probably explained all those things to you that were different about GC&T's website right? The salesperson probably felt they did a very "professional job" explaining it all to you correct?

There does come a time when you have done the "best you could" explaining everything & you just are spent. I can see where some people can be frustrated when beating a "dead horse" & sometimes even feel insulted if the customer acts as if the salesperson, is a liar.

I advise, as I usually do myself to end such conversations with "Have a Nice Day" before hanging up. I would expect after listing with the Trader, again & again, such customers will have a different attitude the next time. Some sales rep's refuse to even call a customer back after giving them a full explaination. They know that that same customer will probably be listed again in the new issue of the Trader & will have still not sold.

So no it probably was not me. I also don't sell Ontario customers anyway. I do understand why though.

Club Moron will take it "wherever they can get it" I guess. Either I made the mistake on the 27th or Rip off Report made the mistake, but either way, it was that. A mistake.

Of course I am not the "Owner of the Company" & most people could see that as a mistake unless they were "looking for problems". However your leader thinks that proves you need meds. Ah hah.

I will give the President some help though. GC&T has a "buyers registry" on the site. It is an icon that is labled "auto notify". That is for people like you who are looking for something they can not find on the website. Also for people who are not happy with what they see. Click on it, tell GC&T what you are looking for & as soon as that pops up, anywhere in N.America... you will get an immediate email. It takes the shopping out of it for you.

Just another little "perk" that GC&T has that the others do not. Arizona sells the vehicles too quickly & would have little on it if there were no Utah ad's.

Dear Reader's;

It is up to you to use your head. You can listen to people who ask questions "over & over again" getting the "same response" & still not getting it. You can listen to people who cannot count & make an issue out of nothing. Adam sure had his problem fixed & is happy today.

You can listen to people who don't have any interest in the site, as they do not have a vehicle on it. You can decide to use "another venue" siteing "spelling mistakes". You can do what you wish with your "hard earned cash".

However if you are the kind of person who has the "kind of control" over your friends, that you feel they cannot make a decision "without you". If you show your respect for your friends by "dis respecting their intelligence". If you are more concerned with "spelling mistakes" instead of financing & a money back guarantee. If everyone related to the company you are about to deal with has to be put under a microscope before you can make a decision, I think your friend has chosen you as one mistakenly. You remind me of a person named "Brenda". Here is what a real "customer" said back to Brenda:

Rebuttal Consumer Suggestion
Submitted: 6/12/2005 4:22:48 AM Modified: 6/12/2005 4:22:48 AM

look at this I am a repeat customer


Rebuttal Consumer Comment
Submitted: 9/30/2004 4:37:44 PM Modified: 9/30/2004 10:44:38 PM

Do us all a favor Brenda and sell your car on Auto Trader and stop bad mouthing a good company


I am a repeat customer at Great Cars and Trucks. I have listed 2 cars my sons motorcycle and a truck and I have sold - 1 of the cars, the motor cycle, and the truck. My total cost $240.00. The money I made of the 3 sales was aprox. $14500.00. It took about 6 months to sell them all but If I would of used the auto trader which I did for a while, it would of cost me about $840.00. I have nothing bad to say about this company and it's unfortunate that some idiot that can't understand a simple money back guarantee can be such a low life and go and post stupid comment about a person named Susan who is just trying to do her job.

You can't please everybody that is true, but you don't have to ruin a good thing for everyone else. Great Cars and Trucks is a legitimate
company with great customer focus and YES they will sell your car, It might not be overnight but who cares for $60.00 you could have your car posted for 5 years if you wanted. No extra fees, you can't go wrong.

Do the math, how much would it cost you if you used Auto Trader at $70.00/biweekly for 5 years?

______________________________________________________________

That letter was written before GC&T had financing. Written before they opened up the USA. Written before GC&T had even 1/2 the listings it has now.

It cost less to list then too. So did the Auto Trader. Now you would probably spend much more money using other venue's that do not have financing backing them up. Today GC&T has more advantages than it did when this letter was written.

So I would advise you to look at the "proof". It is all there. You can count the numbers, you can see the financing. You can read where people have stated they were done with this thread & that we could all "take that to the bank". You can figure out for yourself the motivation of someone commenting on this thread if they have not "real interest in it" other than to cause problems.

You can think you are being a "good friend", by dis respecting your friends & asking them to "allow you" to make their decision for them. I sure would hate to be the salesman dealing with your friend if that was the issue. Thank God the average person can "walk & chew gum at the same time" & can make decisions on their own. After all it is "their money".

Some people "get it". Over 50,000 people at my last count. Understand also those are only the ones "listed today". Never mind the people like the "satisfied customer" above who have already listed & sold their vehicles.

Yes I would advise people to have someone read the thread, that has something for sale. Let them read it themselves. Then make their choice. List or join "Club Moron".

I am glad I found this information about Great Cars & Trucks before I deal with them.

I remember a guy called James from Calgary calling me and rudely hanging up when he I was not convinced about their service. I think he's the same one posting and arguing in vain here in a bad saleman attitude instead of aknowledging the mistake.

A message to James: Do good business.

I am glad I found this information about Great Cars & Trucks before I deal with them.

I remember a guy called James from Calgary calling me and rudely hanging up when he I was not convinced about their service. I think he's the same one posting and arguing in vain here in a bad saleman attitude instead of aknowledging the mistake.

A message to James: Do good business.

I am glad I found this information about Great Cars & Trucks before I deal with them.

I remember a guy called James from Calgary calling me and rudely hanging up when he I was not convinced about their service. I think he's the same one posting and arguing in vain here in a bad saleman attitude instead of aknowledging the mistake.

A message to James: Do good business.

There was once that I mistakenly replied as an employee. Realizing my mistake, it was the only time.

Calling yourself an employee, opens up a "whole can of worms" expecially when you are not.

From the labor board, to unemployment insurance, to income taxes, to being held "legally responsible" for things that you are not.

So yes it was a "major blunder" that I was glad I caught. It does not make me a "split personality", but simply being smart enough to know the problems that can be gernerated by calling yourself an employee when you are not.

Now what does this have to do with GC&T being a viable website to list your vehicle on? Nothing. Absolutely nothing!

I simply made a mistake once, & since it is brought up, I hereby apologize for my blunder.

Now I would advise you to have your friend read the thread, because if anyone in their "right mind" finds creedance in anything said by "Club Moron", I would advise that their issues are much worse than being accused of a "split personality" after a blunder from years ago. I don't know what they can do to get a good understanding of a good idea.

There was once that I mistakenly replied as an employee. Realizing my mistake, it was the only time.

Calling yourself an employee, opens up a "whole can of worms" expecially when you are not.

From the labor board, to unemployment insurance, to income taxes, to being held "legally responsible" for things that you are not.

So yes it was a "major blunder" that I was glad I caught. It does not make me a "split personality", but simply being smart enough to know the problems that can be gernerated by calling yourself an employee when you are not.

Now what does this have to do with GC&T being a viable website to list your vehicle on? Nothing. Absolutely nothing!

I simply made a mistake once, & since it is brought up, I hereby apologize for my blunder.

Now I would advise you to have your friend read the thread, because if anyone in their "right mind" finds creedance in anything said by "Club Moron", I would advise that their issues are much worse than being accused of a "split personality" after a blunder from years ago. I don't know what they can do to get a good understanding of a good idea.

There was once that I mistakenly replied as an employee. Realizing my mistake, it was the only time.

Calling yourself an employee, opens up a "whole can of worms" expecially when you are not.

From the labor board, to unemployment insurance, to income taxes, to being held "legally responsible" for things that you are not.

So yes it was a "major blunder" that I was glad I caught. It does not make me a "split personality", but simply being smart enough to know the problems that can be gernerated by calling yourself an employee when you are not.

Now what does this have to do with GC&T being a viable website to list your vehicle on? Nothing. Absolutely nothing!

I simply made a mistake once, & since it is brought up, I hereby apologize for my blunder.

Now I would advise you to have your friend read the thread, because if anyone in their "right mind" finds creedance in anything said by "Club Moron", I would advise that their issues are much worse than being accused of a "split personality" after a blunder from years ago. I don't know what they can do to get a good understanding of a good idea.

There was once that I mistakenly replied as an employee. Realizing my mistake, it was the only time.

Calling yourself an employee, opens up a "whole can of worms" expecially when you are not.

From the labor board, to unemployment insurance, to income taxes, to being held "legally responsible" for things that you are not.

So yes it was a "major blunder" that I was glad I caught. It does not make me a "split personality", but simply being smart enough to know the problems that can be gernerated by calling yourself an employee when you are not.

Now what does this have to do with GC&T being a viable website to list your vehicle on? Nothing. Absolutely nothing!

I simply made a mistake once, & since it is brought up, I hereby apologize for my blunder.

Now I would advise you to have your friend read the thread, because if anyone in their "right mind" finds creedance in anything said by "Club Moron", I would advise that their issues are much worse than being accused of a "split personality" after a blunder from years ago. I don't know what they can do to get a good understanding of a good idea.

Dawn,

Thanks for the vote of support. I had long ago come to the conclusion that either Jimmy was off his meds, or that his Dr needed to prescribe something different.

What really got me going initially was his "don't bother us for your refund, call VISA" stance. That's no way to conduct business. If a customer gets overcharged for services, then it is first with that company to refund the amount. Only when it becomes evident that they won't deal with you should you go back to your bank or CC company.

What would be fun is for your friend to call GC&T, ask a bunch of questions, then come here and report what they were told. I would do it myself, but with my luck, I would be connected directly with Jimmy.

I went back on their site this morning to see if anyone had a Honda CRX for sale in Arizona. Had one back in '88, and miss it so much I'm considering buying one and restoring it. Anyways, as I was searching the Cars listings for Arizona, I discovered that almost all of the listings are for Utah. Out of about a dozen cars I looked at, only 1 was for sale in Phoenix. And almost every car was listed twice. Figures.

A friend of mine was trying to sell their car so they mentioned GC&T. I told them not to do it until I looked it up and I am glad I did. After reading this thread I have come to some opinions of my own. James is a legendary salesman with a split personality. Don't take my word for it though,just scroll through his rebuttals he went from having a consumer suggestion to an employee. See his rebuttal on 07272005. His first personality must have remembered that he mistakenly id'd himself because he went back to a "suggesting consumer". Uh huh. I dont like people that two step around questions and he two stepped so much his rebuttals began to read more like a person who is in dire need of paxil and counseling. I will be sure to tell my friend to steer clear of this company I wouldnt want them doing business with a salesmen with a split personality and a spelling problem.

OK Jimmy,

Go ahead and continue living in your fantasy world where GC&T is the greatest thing since sliced bread, and where each listing should count as an individual listing (even if it is duplicated numerous times on the site).

I think that I have provided more than enough information to show any informed consumer that there may be reasons why they should not consider advertising with GC&T.

I hope that I have not taken away too much of your time from cold calling ads in the Auto Trader. I would certainly hate to see your commission check shrink.

I did not design the website. I came in "before" financing & when GC&T only had a few Provinces. Salepeople were successful selling the site then, with probably no more than 20,000 vehicles. The only advantages then were having your vehicle listed until sold for a one time fee & the money back guarantee.

Since then it has grown to all of Canada & the USA as well. From 20,000 listings to over 50,000. Financing once brought in was the "kicker" that made the site far superior to other sites. Lot's of people were involved in it's evolution to probably the best website going for your dollar.

Who did what, & when has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that GC&T has so many more benifits than any other website I have seen. I am glad that I was able to help in any way at all.

Why do you keep providing me ammunition Jimmy? Even though I post on many of the reports on this website, I do keep track of what is being said on each. So your last post now has me puzzled.

Let's review what you said on 6/13/05, shall we?

"I am "like I said" neither an employee nor the owner of the company. However I did have my input into the design. I have advised salespeople. Usually to disclose everything. It's not like GC&T's should be "ripping anyone off"."

OK, so back then, it was "you had a hand in the design", but now it's "when I met up with GC&T they only had 20,000 listings". So which is it Jimmy? Did you help design the original site, or did you join them after they had already been doing business?

Keep digging that hole Jimmy, eventually you will reach six feet.

I wrote the number wrong. GC&T has over 50,000 listings! Over 15,000 in Ontario alone. It is easy to count 50,000 even if you only counted the listings in Canada. Never mind the USA that is growing in "leaps & bounds", but as it grows... more people from Canada are buying up those cheaper US vehicles.

Now that the US is "totally up & running", it seems to be selling vehicles "just as fast" as they are added to. US will eventually be much bigger than Canada, as far as listings go.

Yep it sure would have been hard to promote people listing in the US if GC&T did not sell "national ads" in the beginning to get the US up & running.

Now there is "no reason" for anyone to decieve. In some categories GC&T has "more selection" than any other venue I have ever seen!

Now that is "something to be proud of" when you take into account that GC&T does not mix your ad with "dealer ad's". Most of the other venue's don't even give you an option with their search engine to only view "private ad's".

It sure is nice for the customer too. Knowing that if they find something on GC&T's site they want to buy, the financing is there... no matter what their credit rating is like!

That is the "biggest selling feature". Financing! Not how many vehiles are on the site. Not the fact you are not mixed with dealers. Not the "one time only fee". Not the "money back guarantee". The financing available at GC&T is the "biggest selling feature" of all!

Other venue's "say" they can arrange financing. However they usually offer nothing different than your own bank will give you. Most banks will not finance an "old vehicle". GC&T will get you the financing for what you want.

If you want to sell your vehicle, in most cases, people who want to buy it need financing. You may think that is "not your problem" if you are trying to sell your vehicle. You are really "lost" if you think that way!

You can have the "nicest vehicle" & the "best looking ad". You can put your ad up on "every billboard" & have an ad on T.V., radio, the internet & even on "milk cartons". However if no one is able to get the money to buy it... you will not sell.

So salespeople sell that first! The rest of the stuff is mentioned, but only mentioned & it is not really the selling feature.

No one has ever complained about the amount of vehiles on the site. I have never heard of a customer complaining about "duplicate ad's". People look at the site & are impressed. Their only concern is selling their vehicle. Other venue's list ad's for vehicles that are "un obtainable" if someone needs financing. GC&T does not list anything that you can not get if you simply need financing. Big selling feature indeed.

If your vehicle "can sell" it will sell after you list it on GC&T's website. Financing is the biggest selling feature of all!

Oh those early years.

When I first met up with GC$T it was an accomplishment to say they had 20,000 listings. Oh it was hard! Nobody really had a 'pitch". Everybody was "winging it".

What impressed me however was the salespeople. Now I have been around. I have sold many things in many different industries. However the salespeople I met at GC&T were "the best". The very best! I asked myself... "why do people with their abilities work for obviously less money than they could earn selling something else that is known?".

It was then that I "got it". It was not the money. It was the idea. In those days there was no "real competition". Potential customers... yea they "stretched it". Nobody lied... most walked a "fine line".

However as they "picked up the phone" over & over again... the site grew. Craig was never 100% into the idea that it could ever get off the ground. Everyone assured him it would!

So today I am "proud" to say there are "well over" 50,00 listings & if Chris was not so "damned honest" he would quit cleaning the site! More is better than less Chris!

You should overhear Chris talking to customers on the phone. He is "so understanding & kind". I don't think I could come up with his patience.

No I miss no "points". I make one. GC&T is superior to other venue's & needs no defence. Those who put their "blood & sweat" into the idea in the beginning are now proud.

No one is "ripping anyone off" here. They started something that was good for N. America & gave other choices to the community.

I have watched salespeople "reaming out" new ones who do not do their job properly. People who have a "real interest" in making the website the "very best".

So yea, there are "duplicate ad's". Some of them have spelling mistakes. Yes it is not "perfect". If you are looking for problems, you will find them.

However... at the end of the day... the glass is either 1/2 full or 1/2 empty. A good salesman promotes 1/2 full. Any salesman who promotes 1/2 empty ends up "out of work".

My poor leader of "Club Moron" wants salespeople to discuss the "dis advantages" of the site. He is still screaming... "I only got 17 snow peas!".

I hope he gives us all his address so that we can send him a ball to play with in that "rubber room".

Jimmy,

You are missing the point entirely. If you are representing that there are over 50,000 ads on GC&T to prospective clients, then you are misleading them into thinking those are individual ads.

The fact that most ads are duplicated elsewhere is the problem. You either need to give a true accounting of individual ads (which is WAY less than 50,000), or tell them that of those 50,000, a portion of them are duplicate ads.

All you have proven so far is that you misrepresent GC&T to prospective clients. That makes you a liar and a cheat in my book.

I never lie. There are over 50.000 listings. I never said anything about "duplicates" & that does not make me a liar. However I am not the "proud leader" of "Club Moron". I do have a life & I do not spend my life "calculator in hand" running around looking for problems with "good websites",

Here... I know you are starving, so I bring you some turkey, ham, beef & a little pork, some beans, corn, potatoes, ale to wash it down. I bring you bread & butter, fish sticks & soup, some little cabbages & 23 snow peas.

"You friggin liar! I only have 17 snow peas!". Yes that is what the starving man says!

Club Moron backs up the starving mans claim. Yes it is true, he only has 17 snow peas. That means of course that his starvation is the fault of the people bringing him food.

As they "drag your leader away" can you hear his voice in the distance? "I told ya I only got 17 peas... you all are liars!"?

Ahh... I hope they have a good "rubber room" for him.

Jimmy,

You have just proven that you are a bold face liar. As I have pointed out several times, 50,000 is a misleading number, as almost all vehicles are listed multiple times.

Hell, that Camaro Z28 was on there 33 times alone!

So once again, if you tell prospective clients that you have over 50,000 vehicles listed for sale, you are lying to them to get their business. Why should anyone now trust anything else you say?

Dear Patrick;

Yep I would say that GC&T has over 50,000 vehicles on it's website, as "Canada alone" has that many, Count the US websites, they have well over 60,000. There has been as much as 1 million hits per day on this website.

Not something I would "promote" as I would usually try to "undercut it" to make sure I was not telling a lie.

I think saying that GC&T has over 50,000 vehicles on it;s website is enough to promote that part of it, It sure makes you safe.

Now since you are the leader of "Club Moron". I only wish you to get some help. You no longer can add, You really have no "followers" , although you think you might.

Most of your followers can see your insanity & I only address you by name in hopes that you might get some help.

Jimmy,

Two more responses have been posted by you, and yet you still evade my simple question.

Whern talking to a potential client, what do you say is the number of people currently listing ads on GC&T. If you say over 50,000, you are a bold face liar.

Answer the question. Or are you too afraid to admit you are a liar?

Dear Patrick.

I find it great that you do "volenteer work" on this website. I think I am "almost proud" of you.

However with me, I think you are "barking up the wrong tree" as what I do is not a "rip off".

I think Volenteer work is cool & I will give you a "pat on the back for it". You "my friend" are doing something for society. Although I may "not approve". At least with my website anyway.

Yea there are "rip offs". I will admit to that. There are unsurupulous people who try to get something for nothing. I understand why you do what you do. I am "right there" behind you in being the one who will pull the "worms out of the ground".

I just do not see you "head to head" on my issue.

Dear Patrick.

I find it great that you do "volenteer work" on this website. I think I am "almost proud" of you.

However with me, I think you are "barking up the wrong tree" as what I do is not a "rip off".

I think Volenteer work is cool & I will give you a "pat on the back for it". You "my friend" are doing something for society. Although I may "not approve". At least with my website anyway.

Yea there are "rip offs". I will admit to that. There are unsurupulous people who try to get something for nothing. I understand why you do what you do. I am "right there" behind you in being the one who will pull the "worms out of the ground".

I just do not see you "head to head" on my issue.

Dear Patrick.

I find it great that you do "volenteer work" on this website. I think I am "almost proud" of you.

However with me, I think you are "barking up the wrong tree" as what I do is not a "rip off".

I think Volenteer work is cool & I will give you a "pat on the back for it". You "my friend" are doing something for society. Although I may "not approve". At least with my website anyway.

Yea there are "rip offs". I will admit to that. There are unsurupulous people who try to get something for nothing. I understand why you do what you do. I am "right there" behind you in being the one who will pull the "worms out of the ground".

I just do not see you "head to head" on my issue.

Dear Patrick.

I find it great that you do "volenteer work" on this website. I think I am "almost proud" of you.

However with me, I think you are "barking up the wrong tree" as what I do is not a "rip off".

I think Volenteer work is cool & I will give you a "pat on the back for it". You "my friend" are doing something for society. Although I may "not approve". At least with my website anyway.

Yea there are "rip offs". I will admit to that. There are unsurupulous people who try to get something for nothing. I understand why you do what you do. I am "right there" behind you in being the one who will pull the "worms out of the ground".

I just do not see you "head to head" on my issue.

Dear "Club Moron";

I made a mistake. An awful mistake & I am really sorry for it.

I claimed my figures on 4 Provinces & yet I really only listed 3. I forgot that N.Alberta was seperated from S. Alberta & I did not allow for all those Provinces not listed.

Possibly I may have come up with the disease that your leader has. I may not be long for this world.

However I would advise you all that follow "your leader" to get a life & find something that you can make a "difference in" that actually "affects you".

If you feel someone has "ripped you off", then go through the following steps.

1) Analize it! The one you may be upset with may only be a "front" for who is "turning the keys".

2) Ask Questions! You will be amazed at the information you will get when you "ask first" & reason later.

3) Stick to the subject. You loose credability when you speak of their "car" or wives, or habits. Be on topic.

4) Understand human beings. They are not interested in what "you want", unless it helps "them". A good salesman looks for people's want's & gives it to them, in order to get what "he wants". The better he is at doing that, the more successful he is.

5) No one get's ahead by "ripping someone off". Period! You may think so, but they pay for it. What "goes around" comes around! Most of those "bullies" you dealt with in school are problably dead.

6) If the only thing we are going for in this world is "personal wealth"... we have problably lost the meaning of life & we do not need to be even "on this earth". If you have nothing to give & only take, your a d**n looser at life!

7) To love is a great thing. Many people have never done it, but most wish they did. You would be "hard pressed" to find someone who was in the philosophy to "do harm" & reap rewards! Most people just screw up!

I will end it at 7 because it is the way of history. People do not "intentionally rip you off". Those that do fail. They end up hurt or dead.

As people try to do a "good thing", there are people that look upon them as "ripping those people off". Sometimes it is Jealosy. Actually... that is usually the emotion that causes rage.

I am "torn between" those who have "no self esteem" in Middle East Countries, & the "demand for it" in my culture. They seem to handle it better than we do. We need it & they don't expect it.

For our Culture, we seem to be looking around corners & thinking that "everyone is out to get us". If it is "too good to be true... it probably is".

Yet a "good salesman" does not sell what he does not believe in. Bad Salesmen do, but it is easy to point them out. They lie.

Howeveer, most "Bad Salesmen" fail & go on to doing something else. Good Salesmen are washed with their brush. A shame really. The truth is... that you can't make a million dollars not being a friend to anyone. Those with less than a million do not believe that. For the most part.

My advice would be to judge it on the "years in business". If over 3... they must have something "positive" going on.

Rip off's don't last long. 6 months & they are done. Although there are many people who feel that companies "much older than that" have ripped them off. They are "uniformly wrong".

You cannot be in business for over 3 years & be a "rip off" unless you are in politics!

GC&T is not in Politics. It found a "niche" that was needed in society & it made a "go of it" with the "very best salesmen I have ever seen". Honest to the core. The best!

New people come & go & I am at "odds" how they can "screw this up", but they do.

Idiots who think they need to give notice & then "bad mouth" the company! Jerks that talk about the "owners car" or his wife's car & where they keep their money!

When it all ends, money does not mean anything. Love is everything! When you go to your deathbed, you will not be thinking of the money you made! Only the lives you touched! If you did not touch any lives... your an idiot!

Now quit thinking everyone is out to get you & "rip you off". Cause if they are, they will not be successful! They will fail. What about the people who DO "get it"?

I am sorry for those of you in "Club Moron". You do not get it.

Good Salesmen started GC&T & most are still around. This my reader is not a "Rip Off".

Jimmy,

This will be short and sweet. Just answer this question for me.

When you are selling someone an ad on this website and you are giving them your "pitch", what number are you using to describe how many people advertise on GC&T? Again, you continue to evade this question.

And don't worry, I WILL be addressing your math again, I just down have time right now. You see, I do have a life beyond the RipOff Report. Unlike you who has posted 3 long responses in the last 8 hours.

And I also have to make some time today to call back the EDitor of this website. You see, he called me yesterday, probably to talk about doing some volunteer work for the site. I owe him one as this site was instrumental in getting me my refund from a company that ripped me off.

Good day Jimmy!

Here they are...West to East:

BC:
ars (1480)
Domestic Cars, Import Cars, Specialty Cars, Parts & Accessories Motorcycles (117)
Sport bikes, Touring, Motocross, Cruisers
Trucks and SUV (1620)
Domestic SUV's, Import SUV's, Domestic Small Trucks, Import Small Trucks Snowmobiles (47)
mountain, sport, touring, work
MiniVans (176)
Domestic Minivans, Import Minivans ATV (16)
sport, work
Boats (80)
Speed boats, Fishing boats, Yachts, Jetski Motorhomes and RV's (296)
Motorhomes, Camper Vans, Campers, Tent trailers, Golf Carts.
Dealers (32)
For sale, new and used by dealers Commercial Vehicles / Vans (227)
Commercial Vehicles and Vans new and used
Classic and Antique (238)
Classic Cars, Antique Cars Heavy Equipment and Machinery (131)
Construction Equipment, Farm Equipment
Parts & Accessories (3)

Total 4156

Alberta:

South:
Cars (2316)
Domestic Cars, Import Cars, Specialty Cars, Parts & Accessories Motorcycles (172)
Sport bikes, Touring, Motocross, Cruisers
Trucks and SUV (2210)
Domestic SUV's, Import SUV's, Domestic Small Trucks, Import Small Trucks Snowmobiles (63)
mountain, sport, touring, work
MiniVans (241)
Domestic Minivans, Import Minivans ATV (22)
sport, work
Boats (62)
Speed boats, Fishing boats, Yachts, Jetski Motorhomes and RV's (499)
Motorhomes, Camper Vans, Campers, Tent trailers, Golf Carts.
Dealers (37)
For sale, new and used by dealers Commercial Vehicles / Vans (159)
Commercial Vehicles and Vans new and used
Classic and Antique (199)
Classic Cars, Antique Cars Heavy Equipment and Machinery (135)
Construction Equipment, Farm Equipment
Parts & Accessories (0)

Total 6115

Northern Alberta:

Cars (1480) New
Domestic Cars, Import Cars, Specialty Cars, Parts & Accessories Motorcycles, ATV, Snowmobiles (293) New
Sport bikes, Touring, Motocross, Cruisers mountain, sport, touring, work sport, work
Trucks and SUV (1311) New
Domestic SUV's, Import SUV's, Domestic Small Trucks, Import Small Trucks Motorhomes and RV's (498) New
Motorhomes, Camper Vans, Campers, Tent trailers, Golf Carts.
MiniVans & Vans (188)
Domestic Minivans & Vans, Import Minivans & Vans Commercial Vehicles / Vans (313) New
Commercial Vehicles and Vans
Boats (83)
Speed boats, Fishing boats, Yachts, Jet skis Classic and Antique (277) New
Classic Cars, Antique Cars
Heavy Equipment and Machinery (104)
Construction Equipment Farm Equipment and Machinery (112)
Combines, Tractors, All Farm Equipment

Total 4659

Ontario:
Cars (8906) New
Domestic Cars, Import Cars, Specialty Cars, Parts & Accessories Motorcycles, ATV, Snowmobiles (1470) New
Sport bikes, Touring, Motocross, Cruisers mountain, sport, touring, work sport, work
Trucks and SUV (4669) New
Domestic SUV's, Import SUV's, Domestic Small Trucks, Import Small Trucks Motorhomes and RV's (817) New
Motorhomes, Camper Vans, Campers, Tent trailers, Golf Carts.
MiniVans & Vans (779) New
Domestic Minivans & Vans, Import Minivans & Vans Commercial Vehicles / Vans (1538) New
Commercial Vehicles and Vans
Boats (796) New
Speed boats, Fishing boats, Yachts, Jet skis Classic and Antique (784) New
Classic Cars, Antique Cars
Heavy Equipment and Machinery (560) New
Construction Equipment Farm Equipment and Machinery (167) New
Combines, Tractors, All Farm Equipment

Total 15817 (even revised totals show I am not a liar).

4 out of 8 Provinces have"

4156
6115
4659
15817
________
30,747

Now tell me that all of the US & the other 4 Provinces make up less than 20,000.

Again I said GC&T's website has over 50,000 listings & that is not a lie! Never mind the "National Ad's" that are duplicates. If we took that into consideration, the number would be probably close to "double" what I have just listed for 4 Provinces.

Again... what does this have to do with you selling your vehicle? Not much. Only your competition is the issue & less is better than more.

Quick! Git yer leader into a "rubber room". he is at his end.

I hope this is the end of the thread.

You got your money back. However my advice was not so bad.

When you use Visa or Mastercard, it is like you are using a 3rd party to pay your bills.

The 3'rd party gives the money out if they are assured of the right "access code" as per your "credit card number".

If there is a "dispute", of course you try to contact the company who "overcharged you". However failing that, on more than one occasion, you should contact your 3rd party.

Your 3rd party who "gives the money out" should be able to determine whether the charge is correct or not,

If there is no "swipe on the charge" or a signature made by you, your 3rd party should be able to "revoke that charge".

That is what you pay your 3rd party to do.

Companies that did "overcharge you" will not be anxious to refund your money. Your 3rd party should!

Now in "your case" your money was refunded. You got it back & it did not cost you anything. However you decided that the people to blame were the people that overcharged you. You decided to place a "vendetta" on them, as you felt "rightfully that they were in the wrong". You were right!

However, this is why we use 3rd parties. To settle disputes honerably. Your credit card company should have "come to bat" & reversed the charge... immediately!

Instead they "passed the buck" & had "you" go after the company that was at fault. You did not understand or care that they were changing offices. You did not understand or care that they were using a new phone company. You did not understand or care that because of this, they had many emails & messages to respond to. You did not care about any of this! You just did not want to be "double charged" for something you made on a "single charge".

Understandable. Neither would I. However...

When you try to get a response from a company about a "bad charge"... you should not be concerned with this. You may make a call, leave a message... even go as far as to send them an email. However if there is no response... you go to the next step.

The "next step" is not writing a "rip off report". The next step is to demand that your 3rd party reverses the charges & you explain to them what you have already done. It is their job & what they are "paid for" to fix these problems.

The company of "dispute" is not paid to handle these problems. They have less interest in it than your "credit card company". It is the "job" of your credit card company (the 3rd party) to solve such situations.

In the end, you got back what was "overcharged". I think you went the "wrong way" about it. I think you should have called the company who overcharged you "once". After no reply, you should have contacted your credit card company & let them deal with it.

Instead you went on a "rampage" & called & called & emailed & wrote "rip off reports".

My first advice was sound. Don't let your credit card company, your (3rd party) fool with you. It is "their responibility" to make sure you are treated fairly & they get "paid for that".

Whomever advised you to take this into your "own hands" was simply an "hourly employee" who was doing nothing else but "passing the buck"

GC&T did return your money. They were going through major complications at the time. Too many people wanted answers. It took time to get around to you.

Your credit card company could have done the job much easier. They would not need to write "rip off reports". They could have simply "reversed the charges" & you... my friend would have no reason to write a "rip off report".

Yet as it is... they get away clean, because GC&T was honerable enough to give back your money, late, but in full. You meanwhile have no issue with your "credit card company" that could have done this all for you in an instant. They get away "clean" & you feel GC&T is a "rip off". Now who is playing games with who?

Yes "Club Moron" yer leader found Alberta comming up as I said. I guess they cleaned out 2000, or... they are not done yet.

Ontario changes as well. Hey... that means GC&T's are doing their job! Cleaning out "old ad's" & leaving the new. d**n good job those GT&C guys are doin! Count em again "Club Moron", cause if there is 20,000 in Ontario & 6,000 * 2 in Alberta... that makes.... wait... let me git a calculator... um... 32,000 in 2 Provinces? Now we only have 6 to go to make up what? 18,000? To make it 50,000? Hmm. Is that possible? What do you think "Moron Leader"?

Git yer nimble fingers out! Lot's of categories & 8 Provinces... now let's git "down & dirty"!

When we get there "fellow morons" I am sure we will find over 50,000 listings on GT&C's website. However what does that mean if you have no vehicle listed on it?

I can tell you what it means. It means that you have "no life & are looking for problems where they do not exist." If you have no vehicle on the website, then I definately think you have a major problem. You are nuts! Why are you doing this?

Your leader needs to be committed. He needs a nice home with "padded walls". At this point he has lost it. Are you too far in to turn back? You do not have to be like the leader. You can be normal.

I hope you are, as your leader has been "lost in reality" & can no longer think for himself. He is trying to dispute numbers now, as he has nothing else to argue about. Your leader is a "lost cause".

Well we have done our job here I think. Anybody else wanna come up with an "intelligent issue" with GC&T's website?

When we get down to numbers... your leader has definately "thrown in the towel". So sorry for him but it does not have to be you.

Jimmy,

The numbers I posted were what were available to me at the time I researched them. I did count them accurately. Obviously, they have changed since I last looked. But guess what? They have changed again since your last post. As of 8PM PST, here's how they stand for Ontario (my copy and paste is a lot easier to read than your's was):

Cars (8879)
Motorcycles, ATV, Snowmobiles (1212)
Trucks and SUV (4499)
Motorhomes and RV's (755)
MiniVans & Vans (886)
Commercial Vehicles / Vans (1162)
Boats (672)
Classic and Antique (542)
Heavy Equipment and Machinery (576)
Farm Equipment and Machinery (122)

Total = 19305

And Southern Alberta is FINALLY back up. Rest assured that since Tuesday it has said 0 entries. That was the day I started my little investigation, and I know for a fact that it had no entries as I thought that odd since Northern Alberta had so many. And the current total for S Alberta is 6115 (not 8000 as you claim).

So, adding Canada all over again, we have 44,046 total, not "over 60,000" as you say. Again Jimmy, how many of these are duplicated throughout the site? Why are you continuing to dodge the important questions?

Those of you who know your leader... he has still lost his mind.

The actual count for Ontario Vehicles "as I pointed out"... if you add the "cookies in the jar" is 20417. Sheesh never accuse me of "over stating" the facts!

Southern Alberta has been down for 1 day, not a week. Oh & it is to do that "cleaning out" of old ad's that your leader was talking about GC&T never doing. GC&T does it "Province by Province" on a regular basis. However as said before, what this has to do with someone wanting to sell "their vehicle" is beyond me. Something you will have to ask your leader.

Yes the total for Canada actually runs around 60,000 listings but "to be safe", I would normally quote that GC&T has over 50,000 listings.

As for "some funny ad" that a customer obviously changed using their access code... I would say, "Shhh! Don't be a nark!". I personally find it funny. It sure is nice to have the ability to spend the money you spent with GC&T & be able to list "anything you want" on your ad, proving "you are in control".

However "of course" if it got too common, GC&T would have to combat that. For right now... "I'm not tellin". Now the leader of Club Moron may wish to bring it up "over & over" again because he is such a "party pooper", but I think the average person would just "get a smile". So far the "only complaint" is that comming from the leader of "Club Moron" & he does not even have a vehicle on the site... so I doubt GC&T would bother to listen to him.

Yes... those of you who know your leader, I believe he has gone delerious & lost his sence of humor". Maybe you can get him a "happy pill" & a d**n good calculator!

Remember to be a member... you have to swear by the oath to "Have no life, nothing else to do but find problems with a good website" & if you are to be like your leader, keep making promises that we all can "take to the bank", that he is done with this thread.

I believe he has told us all that 4 times on this thread already.

However, you're still off Jimmy.

OK, so using my numbers above, the following needs to be corrected:

Ontario - 19262 entries instead of 8855
N Alberta - 4415 entries instead of 1407

So that revises the total for Canada to 37,888. If S Alberta truly has 8000 as you state (it has been 0 for more than a week now), we are still below 50,000 entries (roughly 46,000), with a vast majority of those listings being duplicates. My mistake was that on the www.vehiclesforsale.ca website, when I did a blank search on all categaories, I saw a total number of entries, but that was just for cars. I did not realize there were more entries if I scrolled down. It was an honest mistake, and I am man enough to admit my error.

So answer me this. What do you tell prospective clients when they ask how many people currently use GC&T? Now be honest. Remember I can call several clients and ask if need be.

And you still haven't said anything about this ad:

http://www.greatcarsandtrucks.com/cgi-bin/bc/classifieds.cgi?session_key=&search_and_display_db_button=on&db_id=3817&query=retrieval

For those who don't want to go to this link, here is what it says under Description:

"Looking for some special attention this evening? I can show you the affection and excitement you need. Soft hands, firm breasts will help us along. Call me, I want to hear from you!"

There is a picture of a woman (supposedly 40 yrs old, and d**n good looking if she is 40), and the price is $50/HR [FIRM]. So who is it Jimmy? Or did someone pull a prank on GC&T and you guys just have not noticed it? Or is it Craig's wife, and he is secretly a pimp?

How about you ex-employee? Any insight on this ad?

Again I ask, would you want to do business with a company that allows this sort of thing on their website?

For an update:

July 28th 2005. Southern Alberta website is being cleaned... That is the reason there are no vehicles on it presently. It should be up soon. Southern Alberta has around 8,000 listings on it alone.

Ontario... you count em. There are over 15,000 listings in Ontario.

You count em & tell me who can add. Never mind your leaders "other mistakes".

Again... only people from "Club Moron" care, because if "you want to sell your vehicle"... you really do not care about other listings, other than the ones that are in competition with you. Usually people like "less competition" than more.

Those at "Club Moron" can "pick pick pick" but in almost "every case" the situation is exactly the same at any other venue except for the money you pay, the financing available, & the money back guarantee. Three "Great things" that make GC&T if not the "best"... definately viable.

Here... count Ontario for yourself here:

Cars (8878) New
Domestic Cars, Import Cars, Specialty Cars, Parts & Accessories Motorcycles, ATV, Snowmobiles (1463) New
Sport bikes, Touring, Motocross, Cruisers mountain, sport, touring, work sport, work
Trucks and SUV (4656) New
Domestic SUV's, Import SUV's, Domestic Small Trucks, Import Small Trucks Motorhomes and RV's (814) New
Motorhomes, Camper Vans, Campers, Tent trailers, Golf Carts.
MiniVans & Vans (777)
Domestic Minivans & Vans, Import Minivans & Vans Commercial Vehicles / Vans (1534)
Commercial Vehicles and Vans
Boats (793) New
Speed boats, Fishing boats, Yachts, Jet skis Classic and Antique (780) New
Classic Cars, Antique Cars
Heavy Equipment and Machinery (557) New
Construction Equipment Farm Equipment and Machinery (165)
Combines, Tractors, All Farm Equipment

I think if you add properly you will come out to over 15,000.

For an update:

July 28th 2005. Southern Alberta website is being cleaned... That is the reason there are no vehicles on it presently. It should be up soon. Southern Alberta has around 8,000 listings on it alone.

Ontario... you count em. There are over 15,000 listings in Ontario.

You count em & tell me who can add. Never mind your leaders "other mistakes".

Again... only people from "Club Moron" care, because if "you want to sell your vehicle"... you really do not care about other listings, other than the ones that are in competition with you. Usually people like "less competition" than more.

Those at "Club Moron" can "pick pick pick" but in almost "every case" the situation is exactly the same at any other venue except for the money you pay, the financing available, & the money back guarantee. Three "Great things" that make GC&T if not the "best"... definately viable.

Jimmy, if you insist that I come on here and prove you wrong, AGAIN, then I will be more than happy to oblige you.

"Your leader says "nothing" that takes away from my last post. With the exception of 1 lie. I personally have counted over 50,000 listings in Canada. Go count em yerself! I don't know what method yer leader was using."

It's called a 10-key calculator. Just so there is no doubt, let me break it down for you. This information was taken directly from the GC&T website, and can be verified by anyone reading this report:

National Search - 1458 entries
British Columbia - 4454 entries
Northern Alberta - 1407 entries
Southern Alberta - 0 entries
Saskatchewan - 3622 entries
Yukon - 1 entry
Quebec - 212 entries
Manitoba - 3281 entries
Ontario - 8855 entries
Nova Scotia/Maritimes - 1174 entries (I combined these two together as they both link to the same page for Nova Scotia)
Northwest Territories - 7 entries
Nunavut - 2 entries

So let's add them all together, shall we? Grand total of 24,473 in Canada, not 50,000+ as you would have us to believe. And again, how many of these are duplicates?

"Cleaning up old ad's should be easy when "you charge to re post them every 2 weeks". However when you never charge them again... you would have to have "magical powers" to know when these vehicles sell. Anyway "so what"? If the seller does not mind getting calls after their vehicle has sold... why should you?"

Only problem is, when you tell your marks "look, over 50,000 people advertise with us!" That is a bold-face lie! And please don't try to tell me you have never used that approach. Don't make me have to prove that too. And do you ever tell clients that when their vehicle sells to make sure they go on the site and delete their ad? No! Because then you could not perpetrate the lie of how many listings there are!

You say that I have no life and spend all my time on here. Well Jimmy, what about you? What's the matter, got too much free time on your hands now that you have called all your "leads"?

Welcome to the club, moron!

Dear Members of "Club Moron";

Your leader says "nothing" that takes away from my last post. With the exception of 1 lie. I personally have counted over 50,000 listings in Canada. Go count em yerself! I don't know what method yer leader was using.

Cleaning up old ad's should be easy when "you charge to re post them every 2 weeks". However when you never charge them again... you would have to have "magical powers" to know when these vehicles sell. Anyway "so what"? If the seller does not mind getting calls after their vehicle has sold... why should you?

So you call about a vehicle & are told it is sold. Aww. That must really hurt! Please don't feel so badly when you call vehicles on other venue's & find "exactly the SAME thing".

I personally know of vehicles that have sold in Alberta to buyers as "far away" as Florida. So I guess it will not hurt to have your vehicle listed in far away places. Classic vehicles sell "anywhere in the Continent". A "great deal" will sell anywhere.

If you check the ad's in "other venue's" & you are looking in "Your State or Province" you will also find ads from "other States & Provinces" as well. This is usually up to the customer. The "customer feels" you might be interested in their vehicle even if you do not live in their area. GC&T is "no different" from any of the other venue's as far as that issue goes.

When you come down to "brass tacks"... what does this have to do with you getting a "good bang for your buck" when listing your own ad? Nothing! Your ad still get's listed & anyone who clicks on your Province or State is able to see it. More will see it if you pay the "extra money" to have it listed "Nationally".

Do other venue's call people from their competition to sway them over to their venue? Most certainly. That's business. When you put your ad out there, with your phone number, you are inviting people to not only call about buying, but also people to call giving you "other choices". Dealers call all these venue's customers on a "regular basis" looking for the desperate people who will just take "less money" & put it on their lot. Again, that's business. I "personally" would rather have "more choices" than less. However I do know of some people with a "bad attitude" that would rather be blind. That old idea "If I want something I will go out & buy it! I don't need to be told it's available"! Well any smart person should be able to see how silly that statement is. If you don't know about it, how can you make a choice?

What does this all have to do with a choice of listing with GC&T? Does it take away from the features previously mentioned? No. Can GC&T prevent you from placing your ad also in other venue's? No. Can you still use GC&T's financing if you got the customer from another venue? Yes! Does placing your ad in more than one venue give you a better chance of selling your vehicle? Yes!

What is a "reasonable amount of money" to spend on ads for your vehicle? I guess that is up to you. However when you list with GC&T you only pay once. The "one" charge is normally less than you will pay for a "limited time" running ad in most other venue's.

Still, I guess I have swayed & am no longer talking to those of you at "Club Moron". You are the people with "no life" & spend your time finding "problems", rather than seeing the advantages of a "good website". If you follow your leader... you can't even count! Province by Province... West to East or East to West... add them up. Over 50,000 listings. This really only matters to members of "Club Moron" because if you just want to sell your vehicle, you care more about "your own" exposure. Also how much it ends up "costing you"! GC&T is not trying to appeal to those of you at "Club Moron". Only to those of you who want to sell your vehicle.

Dear Members of "Club Moron";

Your leader says "nothing" that takes away from my last post. With the exception of 1 lie. I personally have counted over 50,000 listings in Canada. Go count em yerself! I don't know what method yer leader was using.

Cleaning up old ad's should be easy when "you charge to re post them every 2 weeks". However when you never charge them again... you would have to have "magical powers" to know when these vehicles sell. Anyway "so what"? If the seller does not mind getting calls after their vehicle has sold... why should you?

So you call about a vehicle & are told it is sold. Aww. That must really hurt! Please don't feel so badly when you call vehicles on other venue's & find "exactly the SAME thing".

I personally know of vehicles that have sold in Alberta to buyers as "far away" as Florida. So I guess it will not hurt to have your vehicle listed in far away places. Classic vehicles sell "anywhere in the Continent". A "great deal" will sell anywhere.

When you come down to "brass tacks"... what does this have to do with you getting a "good bang for your buck" when listing your own ad? Nothing! Your ad still get's listed & anyone who clicks on your Province or State is able to see it. More will see it if you pay the "extra money" to have it listed "Nationally".

Do other venue's call people from their competition to sway them over to their venue? Most certainly. That's business. When you put your ad out there, with your phone number, you are inviting people to not only call about buying, but also people to call giving you "other choices". Dealers call all these venue's customers on a "regular basis" looking for the desperate people who will just take "less money" & put it on their lot. Again, that's business. I "personally" would rather have "more choices" than less. However I do know of some people with a "bad attitude" that would rather be blind. That old idea "If I want something I will go out & buy it! I don't need to be told it's available"! Well any smart person should be able to see how silly that statement is. If you don't know about it, how can you make a choice?

What does this all have to do with a choice of listing with GC&T? Does it take away from the features previously mentioned? No. Can GC&T prevent you from placing your ad also in other venue's? No. Can you still use GC&T's financing if you got the customer from another venue? Yes! Does placing your ad in more than one venue give you a better chance of selling your vehicle? Yes!

What is a "reasonable amount of money" to spend on ads for your vehicle? I guess that is up to you. However when you list with GC&T you only pay once. The "one" charge is normally less than you will pay for a "limited time" running ad in most other venue's.

Still, I guess I have swayed & am no longer talking to those of you at "Club Moron". You are the people with "no life" & spend your time finding "problems", rather than seeing the advantages of a "good website". If you follow your leader... you can't even count! Province by Province... West to East or East to West... add them up. Over 50,000 listings. This really only matters to members of "Club Moron" because if you just want to sell your vehicle, you care more about "your own" exposure. Also how much it ends up "costing you"! GC&T is not trying to appeal to those of you at "Club Moron". Only to those of you who want to sell your vehicle.

OK Jimmy, so the response I typed last night did not post, so let me break it down for you again. Your comments will be in " ", my response to each comment will follow.

"If you would like to play a game of "follow the moron", I suggest you check on "national vehicles.com", Trader online.com, Auto Trader.com, BuySell.com & check how many vehicles are sold, but still listed. You might find a few."

Is this where you get all your leads from? By cold calling everyone who has placed ads with these resources? I would be curious to find out how many people who sold their vehicle that was listed on GC&T, but that the sale was actually made becasue it was also advertised elsewhere. Those would be some interesting numbers, hmmm?

"Expecially with GC&T, because the only person who removes ad's from the website are the "sellers". Unless of course you would find it "logical" that GC&T would have a "certain power" unknown to mankind that would tell them when these vehicles do sell."

Most people have probably forgotten that their ad was still on there. One has even called to have theirs removed, and it was not. Why didn't the secretary just tell them to go on the site themselves and delete it?

"As far as the U.S. sites go... they were only added around 1 year ago. When they were added, to fill them up quickly... GC&T sold "national ad's". For a "one time fee" they were listed "nationally". Just as when GC&T first started the site, it gave out 100 "free ad's" to begin."

Further proof that you copy and paste ads in multiple states. Let me guess, for the same low price, you offered to list their ad in all states. Seems kind of stupid. Not even a wholesaler would travel 2000 miles just to pick up a vehicle. Why would a private buyer do the same?

"However the 50,000 listings I was speaking of were from Canada. Over that amount actually. So a much larger amount when you take the USA into the mold."

The number I gave above (38,325) was for the ENTIRE GC&T website, CANADA INCLUDED you moron! Pull up your pants Jimmy, your intelligence is showing. Get some reading comprehension skills man! Canada accounted for about 24,000 postings, while the US accounted for the other 14,000. Then, it was determined that most of the US ads were duplicated at least ten times, if not more.

"Since GC&T does not mix "private sellers" with "dealer ad's" as the other venue's do, it is harder to fill up all 50 States with each category."

So we'll just copy and paste ads from one state to another, then represent to potential clients (or should I say "marks"?) that we have thousands of ads in each state, when in reality there could be only a few, or even none at all. Is this what you are trying to say Jimmy?

"However if you look at the Boat Trader "for instance" in Washington... you would find less than 10 private ad's. Why? I mean the Boat Trader has been around for a very very very long time! How is it then that GC&T has a comparable number of privately selling boats on their website after only 1 year?"

Obviously, Boat Trader keeps their ads up to date, and there are currently only ten active private sellers for boats. How about I call every single boat ad listed on GC&T and find out how many are still for sale? Oh, and here;s something GC&T does NOT do that almost every other online classified ad service does, they put the original date the ad was posted. Why doesn't GC&T do that Jimmy. Is it because you don't want potential clients to see just how long all those ads have been on there? Hmmm?

"Obviously given the "vast" difference in history of these 2 websites... GC&T seems to be "way ahead" of the competition!"

First, go back and clean up your website and get rid of all the old ads of boats that have sold, then come back here and let's compare the "vast" difference.

"Why waist (sic) your time going through ad, after ad attempting to find a private seller when you can go to GC&T & find "nothing but them"?"

Yes, and they are so easy to find since each ad is listed multiple times. Why would I go to the Arizona listings, only to have to wade through hundreds of ads from out of state that are of absolutely no interest to me? Now THAT'S a waste of time!

"Hmm... another advantage! I guess some people look at the glass as 1/2 empty when in reality it is 1/2 full!"

Jimmy, I think we all know now what your glass is "1/2 full" of.

"So if you wish to join "Club Moron" & surf away looking for problems... I am sure you will find them. Just as you would find in any other venue. However I challenge you to call a "cross section" in Canada & find the same results as you will find in the USA. 10 times the population. 50 States compared to 8 Provinces. Kinda like compareing (sic) apples to oranges isn't it?"

Sorry Jimmy, but I was not looking for problems, I was looking for lies. And guess what? That's right, I found them! I just might have to take you up on that offer of calling parties in Canada. And by the way, since only until last year GC&T has conducted business solely in Canada, it only makes sense that you have more ads listed there than in the US. Apples to oranges indeed! So it seems Canadians are easier to rip off than us Americans, eh Jimmy?

"One thing you need to do to join "Club Moron". You need to have "no life" & nothing else to do but cause trouble."

I'll bet you dollars to donuts that I have helped more people by posting information on this website (and I'm not talking just on this report, but the website overall) than you have by cold calling leads from Auto Trader.

Oh, and by the way, please feel free to address me directly by name. Believe me, I won't hold it against you.

Is it nice and dark in that hole you have dug for yourself?

Dear Reader;

The benefits are too many for me to keep repeating. Here they are in total:

Why use us! Benefits and Features of GC&T's.c
Your Vehicle is Advertised until SOLD!
One-Time Fee! No Extra Charges!
Risk Free Money Back Guarantee!
Unlimited Changes to Your Ad
User Friendly
Affordable Service
Not Mixed with Dealer Ad's
Fast Ad Posting, with Fresh Vehicles every Day
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Why Would You Not Use GC&T's.com?

Or why would you bother surfing around looking for what was wrong with the site?

If you would like to play a game of "follow the moron", I suggest you check on "national vehicles.com", Trader online.com, Auto Trader.com, BuySell.com & check how many vehicles are sold, but still listed. You might find a few.

Expecially with GC&T, because the only person who removes ad's from the website are the "sellers". Unless of course you would find it "logical" that GC&T would have a "certain power" unknown to mankind that would tell them when these vehicles do sell.

As far as the U.S. sites go... they were only added around 1 year ago. When they were added, to fill them up quickly... GC&T sold "national ad's". For a "one time fee" they were listed "nationally". Just as when GC&T first started the site, it gave out 100 "free ad's" to begin.

However the 50,000 listings I was speaking of were from Canada. Over that amount actually. So a much larger amount when you take the USA into the mold.

Since GC&T does not mix "private sellers" with "dealer ad's" as the other venue's do, it is harder to fill up all 50 States with each category. However if you look at the Boat Trader "for instance" in Washington... you would find less than 10 private ad's. Why? I mean the Boat Trader has been around for a very very very long time! How is it then that GC&T has a comparable number of privately selling boats on their website after only 1 year?

Obviously given the "vast" difference in history of these 2 websites... GC&T seems to be "way ahead" of the competition! They also don't mix you with the dealers! Wow! Now think of yourself as a customer. If you wanted to go to a dealer... wouldn't you just do that? When you are looking at these venue's are you not only looking for "private sellers"?

Why waist your time going through ad, after ad attempting to find a private seller when you can go to GC&T & find "nothing but them"?

Hmm... another advantage! I guess some people look at the glass as 1/2 empty when in reality it is 1/2 full!

So if you wish to join "Club Moron" & surf away looking for problems... I am sure you will find them. Just as you would find in any other venue. However I challenge you to call a "cross section" in Canada & find the same results as you will find in the USA. 10 times the population. 50 States compared to 8 Provinces. Kinda like compareing apples to oranges isn't it?

One thing you need to do to join "Club Moron". You need to have "no life" & nothing else to do but cause trouble.

What can I say, I am a busy little beaver. Jimmy, all I can say is you have brought this on yourself.

As of today at 1PM PST, there are a total of 38,325 individual listings on the entire GC&T website. Those are not bad numbers. But let's examine those numbers, shall we?

First, while compiling these numbers, I noticed that there were 10 states in the US that seemed to have the EXACT SAME NUMBER OF LISTINGS in each category (for a total of 425 listings in each state). Now, granted, I did not look at each of the listings to make sure that they were exact duplicates, but just by looking at the total number of ads in each category, you can tell that they are the same. It looks like these are all states that had no ads in them, so they took the ads from one state and copied them in to all the empty ones (9 to be exact).

So let's take 9 times 425 = 3,825 ads to be removed from the total. This brings the total ads down to 34,500.

Now, as I have shown above, the two listings I investigated had a total of 53 entries on this site. That's an average of 26.5 listings per vehicle. But let's be conservative and say the overall average is 15 listings per ad (although it is probably higher, like I said, conservative). So 34,500 divided by 15 = 2,300 ads. That is a far cry from the 50,000 ads that Jimmy claims are on the website currently (see his post here dated 6/10/05).

And out of those 2,300 ads, how many are really active? I have only called one listing, and was told it was sold months ago. So Jimmy, should I go call some more? Get an average of active ads and work the number down even further?

How about when I call, I tell each of them I am a consumer advocate and want to get some information about their experience with GC&T? I wonder what kind of responses I'll get? I wonder how many would remember that their salesman was Jim Stewart?

I am a seeker of the truth. The comments made by the former sales person, and Jim's comments, have prompted me to research this further. I'm sure by the information I have presented, it is clear GC&T is not the "be all/end all" of used car websites that Jimmy claims. So in conclusion, here is my opinion of GC&T (Wally, tell me if this sounds right):

GC&T is a 2-bit hack used car website, whose sales people (that's "Independent Contractors" for Jimmy) spend all their time cold calling people who have placed for sale ads in other publications, and hooks them into GC&T by dangling the "money back guarantee" carrot in front of them, but failing to disclose just how many hoops you have to jump through to get a refund.

Thank you for your time.

Dear Readers;

To anyone who questions some moron who has nothing better to do than do searches on GC&T website looking for irregularities & pointing out "spelling mistakes"... I will answer here.

GC&T is not perfect & yes there are some mistakes on the website. They try their best. Salespeople are advised to have the customer input their own information so that mistakes are combatted. Sometimes the inputer enters the ad in the wrong area. These things do happen. Just as on "any website" you could find. How many complaints GC&T gets from people who have used the Auto Trader for instance, listing wrong prices & wrong phone numbers, & putting their vehicle in the wrong category would amaze you!

So yes GC&T does make mistakes as well. However having the ability to go into your own ad & make changes to it at will, is something these other venue's do not offer. Usually they only make changes on a "weekly basis" & so mistakes need to wait a period of time to be fixed. Since GC&T gives you an "access code" to your ad, mistakes can be fixed immediately!

So even on the "mistake issue" GC&T is far superior to most other venue's! Now if your ad is posted in your State or Province & also posted in another that is "not related"... who cares? More exposure is better than less right? I certainly cannot hurt. Often therefore these mistakes are not deleted, as GC&T "does not get complaints" about the issue.

The only people who would have complaints or critisize are people who are simply "trouble makers" as I have pointed out before. People with "nothing better to do" than to concern themselves with a website that they do not even have a vehicle on. People who "need a life".

Patrick,
You have poor old James, Jim, Jimmy or whoever he is in a real state now. Fancy telling the truth about how much of a fraud he and his cronies are! Well done on the investigation front, you have him ducking for cover. He can't deny your facts, any of us can easily check and see who is telling the truth now. Sorry James - you lose. Patrick is guilty only of exposing you for the sham you are. A contractor is a technical employee so don't bother to try splitting hairs. Anonymous obviously did the right thing and told not so great cars and trucks that he would be leaving, as any ethical contractor would. You have not one shred of credibility left James - you can try to denigrate Patrick and myself as much as you like but all readers see you exposed for what you are - a liar, cheat and absolutely heartless. I hope one day you can dig yourself out of the mire you are in and rejoin us in the human race. You can make a very comfortable living without scamming people. Grow up and be a man, it's a great feeling!!!

Patrick,
You have poor old James, Jim, Jimmy or whoever he is in a real state now. Fancy telling the truth about how much of a fraud he and his cronies are! Well done on the investigation front, you have him ducking for cover. He can't deny your facts, any of us can easily check and see who is telling the truth now. Sorry James - you lose. Patrick is guilty only of exposing you for the sham you are. A contractor is a technical employee so don't bother to try splitting hairs. Anonymous obviously did the right thing and told not so great cars and trucks that he would be leaving, as any ethical contractor would. You have not one shred of credibility left James - you can try to denigrate Patrick and myself as much as you like but all readers see you exposed for what you are - a liar, cheat and absolutely heartless. I hope one day you can dig yourself out of the mire you are in and rejoin us in the human race. You can make a very comfortable living without scamming people. Grow up and be a man, it's a great feeling!!!

Patrick,
You have poor old James, Jim, Jimmy or whoever he is in a real state now. Fancy telling the truth about how much of a fraud he and his cronies are! Well done on the investigation front, you have him ducking for cover. He can't deny your facts, any of us can easily check and see who is telling the truth now. Sorry James - you lose. Patrick is guilty only of exposing you for the sham you are. A contractor is a technical employee so don't bother to try splitting hairs. Anonymous obviously did the right thing and told not so great cars and trucks that he would be leaving, as any ethical contractor would. You have not one shred of credibility left James - you can try to denigrate Patrick and myself as much as you like but all readers see you exposed for what you are - a liar, cheat and absolutely heartless. I hope one day you can dig yourself out of the mire you are in and rejoin us in the human race. You can make a very comfortable living without scamming people. Grow up and be a man, it's a great feeling!!!

Patrick,
You have poor old James, Jim, Jimmy or whoever he is in a real state now. Fancy telling the truth about how much of a fraud he and his cronies are! Well done on the investigation front, you have him ducking for cover. He can't deny your facts, any of us can easily check and see who is telling the truth now. Sorry James - you lose. Patrick is guilty only of exposing you for the sham you are. A contractor is a technical employee so don't bother to try splitting hairs. Anonymous obviously did the right thing and told not so great cars and trucks that he would be leaving, as any ethical contractor would. You have not one shred of credibility left James - you can try to denigrate Patrick and myself as much as you like but all readers see you exposed for what you are - a liar, cheat and absolutely heartless. I hope one day you can dig yourself out of the mire you are in and rejoin us in the human race. You can make a very comfortable living without scamming people. Grow up and be a man, it's a great feeling!!!

Let's try another one, shall we? Let's see, something that is easily searchable.... How about a 1998 Chevrolet Camero Z28, candy apple red with T tops, for sale in Cleveland Ohio. Should be easy to find, right?

Search results:

33 (yes, 33!) ads. And some states even have it listed multiple times (3 in Colorado, 2 each in Oregon and Nevada). I guess the secretaries had forgotten which states they had already copied the ad to.

Wow, this guy must be really hot to sell this car, especially since he also wanted it listed way up in the Northern Territories! Maybe Raymond needs to be called to find out if he has had any takers yet?

Are we starting to see a trend now Jimmy? I think so.

And now I have to address one of your comments. You said:

"Why not investigate something you have a personal interest in? Would that make more sence (sic)?"

Let me tell you what I have a personal interest in. I have a personal interest in seeing someone not get ripped off by a dishonest company. I have an interest in seeing people get revenge when they do get ripped off.

Oh, and let me clue you in on something Jimmy. You are not special. You are not the only one on this website that I debate with. I have posted on hundreds of reports, some of which I have a personal interest in, others (such as this one) where it was obvious that someone (Adam) had been ripped off by a dishonest company.

Quote: "Ahh what the hey. I am sure by now if someone has read along with any of these threads, they will see people who are proven in lies... shown to be what they are "by me" & that is for sure."

Are you talking about when you indentified Wally as a clod? Ha, that was a good one!

"People who have "ranted & raved" & been given "good answers" to their submissions as to why things are the way they are, who still come back with the same rediculous (sic) question. Or issue."

I'm sorry, but you have yet to give me any "good answers" yet. Give me a good answer about how many actual individual listings there are currently on the GC&T sites whose cars are still up for sale. C'mon, be honest now!

"...you know that some people feel "at home" with liars..."

Then we should feel right at home with you then, eh Jimmy?

Again, GC&T is just a second rate hack site.

Jimmy,

I am disappointed. I thought you could do better than that! And I was so hoping you would tell us all whose wife that was that was advertised for $50 a night for a "good time".

And so there is no doubt, look up ad #3363 (easy to find, it's on the site 20 times!). 1998 Toyota Sienna XLE minivan for sale by Donald in Independence, KY USA. His number is on the ad. Rest assured I called about 5:30 this afternoon to inquire about the van, and his wife(?) said they had sold it over 3 months ago, and that they had called GC&T to remove the ad.

Oh, and the funny thing is, she acted like that was the first call they had gotten in response to that ad since the sale. That must say a lot, especially since it was advertised in 20 different states.

And yes, I did say I was going to stop posting on this thread. But then the ex-employee (former Independent Consultant, or whatever you want to call yourself) posted such juicy details about the inner workings of GC&T, I just had to comment.

What's the matter, no comment about the multiple ads issue? Hmmmm? What's the matter, has your tongue swollen from all the lies you have told?

If you ask me, GC&T is a second rate hack website that doesn't produce results. Keep cold calling those Auto Trader ads for leads. That's the only way you are going to drive business to your lame site.

How many times have I said in past links that GT&C does not have "employee's"? That anyone that called himself one would be a "liar from the beginning"? However when you are dealing with people who say things like:

You know what, never mind. I have grown tired of the same old response from you. I am done with this topic, and will not respond to you any further. You can take that to the bank.

Then constantly post new stuff on the same thread... you know that some people feel "at home" with liars. That is why they treat such people as good friends & believe such liars are telling the truth about "anything".

How many times have I said that some people "pay" to have their ad's placed in other States & Provinces? At least twice I think. Well here it is for the 3rd time. Now when one of these liars comes on to say they spoke to someone who said it is not so... just remember who it is comming from.

Why not investigate something you have a personal interest in? Would that make more sence?

Ahh what the hey. I am sure by now if someone has read along with any of these threads, they will see people who are proven in lies... shown to be what they are "by me" & that is for sure.

People who have "ranted & raved" & been given "good answers" to their submissions as to why things are the way they are, who still come back with the same rediculous question. Or issue.

It's either they can't read, understand, or are so "forgetfull" that you need to feel sorry for them. Otherwise you can see them for who they are... "liars & troublemakers".

How many times have I said in past links that GT&C does not have "employee's"? That anyone that called himself one would be a "liar from the beginning"? However when you are dealing with people who say things like:

You know what, never mind. I have grown tired of the same old response from you. I am done with this topic, and will not respond to you any further. You can take that to the bank.

Then constantly post new stuff on the same thread... you know that some people feel "at home" with liars. That is why they treat such people as good friends & believe such liars are telling the truth about "anything".

How many times have I said that some people "pay" to have their ad's placed in other States & Provinces? At least twice I think. Well here it is for the 3rd time. Now when one of these liars comes on to say they spoke to someone who said it is not so... just remember who it is comming from.

Why not investigate something you have a personal interest in? Would that make more sence?

Ahh what the hey. I am sure by now if someone has read along with any of these threads, they will see people who are proven in lies... shown to be what they are "by me" & that is for sure.

People who have "ranted & raved" & been given "good answers" to their submissions as to why things are the way they are, who still come back with the same rediculous question. Or issue.

It's either they can't read, understand, or are so "forgetfull" that you need to feel sorry for them. Otherwise you can see them for who they are... "liars & troublemakers".

Wally,

Read on, you are going to love this!

OK, so I have done a little investigating. First, I wanted to see what was available here in Arizona (actually, my step-mother needs a car, so why not check here too?). I picked an easy category, Minivans. There was only one listing. But what's this? The vehicle owner is in Kentucky? So I think to myself "Why would someone in Kentucky advertise his vehicle for sale 2000 miles away in Arizona?"

Here's where it gets interesting. So I click on Kentucky, go to Minivans, and guess what? That's right, the same ad is listed there, too! But wait, it gets even better. I searched every single state, and I found the SAME EXACT AD in 20 (yes, I said TWENTY!) states. Surely I thought the this person wouldn't be so desperate to sell that he would place 20 seperate ads just on GC&T alone?

So I picked up the phone and called the number. A lady answers, and I ask about the minivan for sale. She has a puzzled tone to her voice, and said they sold that thing months ago. She asks where I saw the ad, I said GC&T. "Oh, we called them and told them to take off the ad when we sold it." I mentioned I saw their ad in 20 different states, and she said they had only placed it for Kentucky, and had only paid for one ad. Well now, that's interesting.

During my search for this one vehicle, I also noticed that other vehicles were listed multiple times. Tag lines like "LOOK! It has a NEW engine!" and "My Dad says it's a Great Deal" and "Very Nice Interior" tend to stick out. I saw them AT LEAST 10 times, if not more. I was not keeping track of those. Bet they've all been sold too.

And I have just barely scratched the surface. If this one ad was listed 20 times, and it sold over 3 months ago, and GC&T was called and told to remove the ad, then how can you say how many truly active ads there are right now? So Jimmy, care to revise that 50,000 number down somewhat? I would say 2,000 to 3,000 is probably more like it, and probably only 200 or 300 are actively for sale. Granted, these are just my best guestimates based on what I have observed so far.

Also during my search, I came across something that caught my eye. This was listed under minivans in British Columbia. Instead of make and model in the tag line, it says "BEST OFFER FOR: My Wife". So I clicked on more details, and OH MY GOD! Trust me, you WILL want to copy and paste this URL into your web browser for a look:

http://www.greatcarsandtrucks.com/cgi-bin/bc/classifieds.cgi?session_key=&search_and_display_db_button=on&db_id=3817&query=retrieval

I wonder how many replies THAT ad has gotten so far? And are the goods still up for sale?

OK, all comedy aside, would you want to do business with a company that would put ads such as this on their website? What is the average consumer to think when they see such things? How can Craig allow stuff like this to happen? Could it be that he doesn't give a s**t, and only cares about how much money he can stuff into his offshore account?

Now to this I say, let the Readers decide! And yes Jimmy, you can "TAKE THAT TO THE BANK!"

James, I take it that is a no. Once again you are being your dastardly worst and you must have thought I was asking for a refund. Please reconsider, I would love to become an opinionated moron like you but I guess you won't allow it - you're the best and don't want any competition from the southern hemisphere.

Patrick I'm back - please forgive my moment of madness. I really wanted to experience the depths of James' life but I guess I'm resigned to being an honest, ethical all round good bloke with a conscience. Boring huh?

First to Jimmy - Shut up, I was not talking to you. d**n but you are dense.

Wally, d**n funny stuff, I almost fell out of my chair again laughing. Don't go to the dark side! Darth James will sell your soul to Emperor Craig!

I hope the ex-employee does post Jimmy's number. Boy could I have some fun!

Hmmm. Ex-employee says that most of the current ads are either very outdated, or are copied multiple times on different territories. This bears some further investigation. I will let everyone know what I find out.

Again, Jimmy, I am not talking you blockhead.

Is it the 4th time we can all "take it to the bank"? As for honest people... let's just see if Mr No Name can produce my girlfriends phone number as he said he could do.

Yea I think someone went the the wrong doctor. The right one would have told him to comment only "what affects him. Heck you don't see me bitching about people killing "roo's" now do you.

The 3 of you are meant for eachother. It is only "too bad" none of you have anything intelligent to say. Or at least be concerned with something that "affects you".

Oh well I am sure anyone who has been affected knows now the answers to their questions. I am glad to be of service for that.

Any future questions by people affected I will be glad to answer.

You other 3... I just hope you get a life.

Thank you James, thank you!!!!!

Well I took your advice James and sought professional help with my clod making problems. I was honest with the therapist and told him how I enjoy putting down crappy websites a hemisphere away from me and the salespeople??? who tend to rip off genuine people like me. He hit the nail on the head straight away and told me I have an almost incurable problem. He sat me down and broke the news that I am afflicted with honesty, ethics and an IQ larger than my shoe size.

I asked how I could attain the dizzy heights of James in Calgary and he told me it would be difficult. The only chance I have is to have a frontal lobotomy, go to shysters school for many years and forget about treating people as equals.

Should I do it James? Could I make $300 per hour like you. Could I be disliked by as many people as you are? Could I become as pigheaded as you? Would you recognise me as a peer and stop calling me a clod? It is a big step for me but with your support I could become an illiterate, uncaring wanker like you.

Please let me know ASAP and then you and I together can put down that nasty Patrick and that awkward Anonymous. I'm already starting to dislike honest people like them after just thinking about becoming like you. I would have to be the most excited clod in the southern hemisphere!!! Don't keep me waiting for too long.

Sorry Patrick but if you can't beat 'em you have to join'em. Give it some thought mate, you too could become another James clone. Tempting isn't it?

Dear Nameless;

Sure give out my phone number. Let's see if it's right! Sure give out some "girlfriends of mine" phone number. I am sure you will surprise some woman.

As far a "independant contractors" go... I am glad to be one. I don't have a "drug habit", nor do I sleep with anyone I work with, as I would find that unprofessional. I also do not work out of an office.

Offices are meant for people who do not either have the means to work on their own, or for people who do not have the ability to work on their own. Oh... sorry... I guess you were one of those. As you seem to admit.

What people drive or where they put their money is their own business. Why anyone would accept "notice" from someone dumb enough to give it as an "independant contractor" is beyond me.

Since you say you worked there... even though you thought you were an "employee" & were not... let me ask you something.

How much office politics is going on at the Auto Trader? How many of their people do drugs? I know many of them cannot afford any at $10 per hour... but I am sure you should point it all out as a comparison.

How much does it cost to put an ad with them? What is their success rate? What rates of interest does the Auto Trader charge for their financing? I am sure you have all that information as well. Then once you post it, we could all compare GC&T with other venues. Oh & make sure you let us know what kind of car the Auto Trader owners drive, their wives & where they bank.

Or possibly "get a life" & find a "real job" where you can work for someone else who has the "guts" to be self motivated & earn their own income in order to hire you. They will appreciate your notice when you leave. They might even give you a nice letter to take with you, as you go to work for someone else that has "self motivation".

If you thought it was a "rip off"... why did you not call the police while you worked there? No one would be against you if you "quit immediately" because you thought it was a rip off! Why in God's name would you "give notice" & continue to work for a "rip off". Has anyone pointed out the "definition of insanity" to you?

You seem to be the "worst kind of looser" a sore one. You say you left. Then go & find something "good to say" about your next employer. I know that is really why you refuse to leave your name, as if you did, your new employer would want to get rid of you before you started "bad mouthing" them. Just as you have done "unfairly" to GC&T. Jibberish is all you are spouting. Just as it would be jibberish if you gave out my number, as you my friend "do not know it" or any woman's that is connected to me.

Hi everyone.

Every once in a while I read these reports on Great Cars and Trucks and I wonder how this company is still in business.

Jim, why don't you just give it up already? Everyone knows you're a pathetic liar. The only reason you defend this company is because of your own peace of mind. You don't want to admit to yourself that you are a scam artist so making up these excuses makes you feel better about working there. Trust me I used to do it too when I worked there. But deep down you know the truth.

Now I'm not a bitter former employee, I didn't even get fired. I actually gave my notice and everything. I just don't like the way these people do business. Craig goes around driving a Hummer and his wife drives a new Chev Truck. They live in Pump Hill and they think they're so innocent with their church going habits and fake beliefs. All this they get from stealing people's money and putting it in Craig's little offshore account. This whole company started with Craig getting an insurance settlement anyway. He didn't even go to business school to start this.

If you go on the website and go through different provinces and states, you will actually see that there are so many multiple listings. This is what Craig made the secretaries do in their spare time. He made them copy and paste ads into various places to make the website look bigger than it is. Most of the ads that you see are just duplicates. The rest are just so old that these people don't even remember having these vehicles any more. As you know, you get advertising until your vehicle sells. So when your ad goes on the website, it stays on forever, they don't clean their website. It's up to you to call and ask them to delete it or to delete it yourself, which I'm sure nobody does condidering the amount of old ads on the site. Every once in a while, the system will crash and ads that have been on for 180 days will be purged. But other than that, they stay on forever.

Great Cars and Trucks is not exactly the most professional place anyway. There are so many fights there all the time. There is so much drug use at the desks that people get fired over that but surprise surprise, they take them back. There are so many people sleeping with other people, so much alcohol and poker going on, let alone how many times the cops have been there investigating credit card fraud. The list can go on for a while but you get the idea.

Anyways, the whole purpose of this report is really that I hate seeing crooks ripping people off. You will get yours eventually Craig. Karma's a b***h. Easy come easy go. What comes around goes around. I'm sure you've heard all this before but it doesn't phase you any more.

There are so many things that I can say about this company but when you actually come to write them down you can't think of everything all at once. So you will be hearing from me again when I remember more things that happened.

And Jim, why don't you just tell them that you are a salesperson that works from home. They call their salespeople independent contractors because that way the company doesn't take responsibility for all the lying that goes on. Go on Jim. Don't make me give them your house phone number. I still remember it. Or should I give them your girlfriend's number. Don't you work from her house sometimes? Yeah good luck on that. Get a real job.

Anyways, I'm out. If any of you have any questions I'd be more than happy to answer them.

Always here to help!

Cheers.

Gee Wally,

Looks like he got you on that one! A clod indeed! With an attitude like that, I can't wait to do business with GC&T! Where do I sign up? I feel like giving away $100 today!

I am sure any reader can see how much of a clod you are & hopefully you can find some websites on "your side of the planet" to put down. Maybe you can also enroll yourself into some sort of "help program" as well. Just tell them how you like to put down websites on the other side of the world & I am sure they will give you the help you need.

While they are at it, they might help you with your in ability to "ask questions" before you make blatent statements. You assume "way too much".

Lighten up James. You have told us over and over why you think your site is the best thing since sliced bread. Nobody believes you and everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Look outside the square at some stage and you could probably find several hundred like sites that are superior to yours. Live in your little cocoon by all means and ignore the opinion of everyone else but for goodness sake get a life.

I am devastated because you have called me a clod - not once but several times. I don't know how I can carry on - but I'll try hehe. Have a lovely life and make sure you continue to be unable to recognise what a fool you are making of yourself. Everybody already knows I am a clod, James has told them!

Very best wishes from the clod from Down Under

Dear Reader;

Again we hear from an insulting clod who does not even live on this side of the planet! No interest in this site at all, but to stir up trouble. A person that can not understand, what I have told him before. That is:

Refunds are given to people who can show proof that they still own the vehicle. Obviously! GC&T does not wish to hand out money to people who might "claim" to have not sold their vehicle, but only to those that can show proof of that. Proof also of what they paid. Any store asks for the same. It is not a "satisfaction guarantee" but a money back one if the vehicle "does not sell". Not hidden! Clearly explained on the website.

As far as salesmen being "charged back" for their commissions goes. No. Why should they? The salesman did their job. They deserve to get paid, just as the imputer does as well. However as said before "I personally" have seen the refunds given to the people who follow the rules.

As those are the only "real questions" this clod raises in his letter of personal insult, it is all I feel the need to comment on. Even though I have answered these questions to him before "over & over again".

Reader It is honestly not as if I have not answered this question before for him. This is probably the 3rd time. So who is "brain dead"? Can you understand what I meant was "guarantee" when it was written guarntee? I doubt many of you would have such problems like this clod. A guy that does not know me from "Adam" but could spout in the "beginning" his vast sales training being so much better than mine.

Being "independant" I can choose to charge what I wish for my services & that again is "no business of his". Not to put down anyway! I am not a journalist. I do not make money using the pen. I am a salesman & a "d**n good one" who does not persude people with insults. Yet in his case, he does not want to be persuaded. His questions "answered" are not realistic.

Lastly, with "no direct interest" in anything to do with GC&T... this "great salesman" with all this training, has nothing else to do but to spout garbage & insult a business on the other side of the world! Man what a looser!

As for this "other guy" who is more concerned with pinning down "what my position is" with GC&T, since he cannot dispute any longer how the company is runned, I have explained everything to him as well. Even though he has no vehicle on the website & also has no interest in it other than to stir up trouble.

This is the 3rd time now that he has said he was done with this thread & even told us all that we could take that "to the bank". Yet he keeps coming back... just like heartburn. Only to ask "non relevant questions".

If I made claims about GC&T & called myself an employee... I could be "legally held responsible" for such claims. That is why I have "made it clear" that I am not. That is why he was pushing to "pin me down" as well. Other idiots who claimed to be employees & spouted "garbage" at least were "smart enough" to not leave their names. Simply because "they know" what they wrote was slander & filled with lies. What I say is true & so I am not afraid to leave my name.

I have explained "every aspect" of GC&T. Why the rules are what they are & all the advantages of this website. GC&T might be right or might not be right for you. However it definately is "no rip off". I think I have made that all "quite clear", nomatter my looks, few mis spelled words, my sales training, my experience, what position I hold, or what my sexual orientation is. I have done my best to explain why GC&T is "more fair" & honest than other venues & why.

Dear Reader;

Again we hear from an insulting clod who does not even live on this side of the planet! No interest in this site at all, but to stir up trouble. A person that can not understand, what I have told him before. That is:

Refunds are given to people who can show proof that they still own the vehicle. Obviously! GC&T does not wish to hand out money to people who might "claim" to have not sold their vehicle, but only to those that can show proof of that. Proof also of what they paid. Any store asks for the same. It is not a "satisfaction guarantee" but a money back one if the vehicle "does not sell". Not hidden! Clearly explained on the website.

As far as salesmen being "charged back" for their commissions goes. No. Why should they? The salesman did their job. They deserve to get paid, just as the imputer does as well. However as said before "I personally" have seen the refunds given to the people who follow the rules.

As those are the only "real questions" this clod raises in his letter of personal insult, it is all I feel the need to comment on. Even though I have answered these questions to him before "over & over again".

Reader It is honestly not as if I have not answered this question before for him. This is probably the 3rd time. So who is "brain dead"? Can you understand what I meant was "guarantee" when it was written guarntee? I doubt many of you would have such problems like this clod. A guy that does not know me from "Adam" but could spout in the "beginning" his vast sales training being so much better than mine.

Being "independant" I can choose to charge what I wish for my services & that again is "no business of his". Not to put down anyway! I am not a journalist. I do not make money using the pen. I am a salesman & a "d**n good one" who does not persude people with insults. Yet in his case, he does not want to be persuaded. His questions "answered" are not realistic.

Lastly, with "no direct interest" in anything to do with GC&T... this "great salesman" with all this training, has nothing else to do but to spout garbage & insult a business on the other side of the world! Man what a looser!

As for this "other guy" who is more concerned with pinning down "what my position is" with GC&T, since he cannot dispute any longer how the company is runned, I have explained everything to him as well. Even though he has no vehicle on the website & also has no interest in it other than to stir up trouble.

This is the 3rd time now that he has said he was done with this thread & even told us all that we could take that "to the bank". Yet he keeps coming back... just like heartburn. Only to ask "non relevant questions".

If I made claims about GC&T & called myself an employee... I could be "legally held responsible" for such claims. That is why I have "made it clear" that I am not. That is why he was pushing to "pin me down" as well. Other idiots who claimed to be employees & spouted "garbage" at least were "smart enough" to not leave their names. Simply because "they know" what they wrote was slander & filled with lies. What I say is true & so I am not afraid to leave my name.

I have explained "every aspect" of GC&T. Why the rules are what they are & all the advantages of this website. GC&T might be right or might not be right for you. However it definately is "no rip off". I think I have made that all "quite clear", nomatter my looks, few mis spelled words, my sales training, my experience, what position I hold, or what my sexual orientation is. I have done my best to explain why GC&T is "more fair" & honest than other venues & why.

Dear Reader;

Again we hear from an insulting clod who does not even live on this side of the planet! No interest in this site at all, but to stir up trouble. A person that can not understand, what I have told him before. That is:

Refunds are given to people who can show proof that they still own the vehicle. Obviously! GC&T does not wish to hand out money to people who might "claim" to have not sold their vehicle, but only to those that can show proof of that. Proof also of what they paid. Any store asks for the same. It is not a "satisfaction guarantee" but a money back one if the vehicle "does not sell". Not hidden! Clearly explained on the website.

As far as salesmen being "charged back" for their commissions goes. No. Why should they? The salesman did their job. They deserve to get paid, just as the imputer does as well. However as said before "I personally" have seen the refunds given to the people who follow the rules.

As those are the only "real questions" this clod raises in his letter of personal insult, it is all I feel the need to comment on. Even though I have answered these questions to him before "over & over again".

Reader It is honestly not as if I have not answered this question before for him. This is probably the 3rd time. So who is "brain dead"? Can you understand what I meant was "guarantee" when it was written guarntee? I doubt many of you would have such problems like this clod. A guy that does not know me from "Adam" but could spout in the "beginning" his vast sales training being so much better than mine.

Being "independant" I can choose to charge what I wish for my services & that again is "no business of his". Not to put down anyway! I am not a journalist. I do not make money using the pen. I am a salesman & a "d**n good one" who does not persude people with insults. Yet in his case, he does not want to be persuaded. His questions "answered" are not realistic.

Lastly, with "no direct interest" in anything to do with GC&T... this "great salesman" with all this training, has nothing else to do but to spout garbage & insult a business on the other side of the world! Man what a looser!

As for this "other guy" who is more concerned with pinning down "what my position is" with GC&T, since he cannot dispute any longer how the company is runned, I have explained everything to him as well. Even though he has no vehicle on the website & also has no interest in it other than to stir up trouble.

This is the 3rd time now that he has said he was done with this thread & even told us all that we could take that "to the bank". Yet he keeps coming back... just like heartburn. Only to ask "non relevant questions".

If I made claims about GC&T & called myself an employee... I could be "legally held responsible" for such claims. That is why I have "made it clear" that I am not. That is why he was pushing to "pin me down" as well. Other idiots who claimed to be employees & spouted "garbage" at least were "smart enough" to not leave their names. Simply because "they know" what they wrote was slander & filled with lies. What I say is true & so I am not afraid to leave my name.

I have explained "every aspect" of GC&T. Why the rules are what they are & all the advantages of this website. GC&T might be right or might not be right for you. However it definately is "no rip off". I think I have made that all "quite clear", nomatter my looks, few mis spelled words, my sales training, my experience, what position I hold, or what my sexual orientation is. I have done my best to explain why GC&T is "more fair" & honest than other venues & why.

Tell your readers James, as a 'contactor' who feels his value is $300 per hour, do you have to refund the commission you have been paid if GC&T refunds a customer who failed to sell his/her vehicle? I'm sorry to ask such a difficult question but would you mind researching it for me and see if there has ever been such a refund made. It will give all of your readers an insight into why you so steadfastly defend the right of GC&T to make it as difficult as possible to receive a refund. If it has the potential to cost you money personally that would clear up the mystery of why you dedicate so much time defending the indefensible.

After much pushing by Patrick you have finally admitted your interest in the business. I nearly fell off my chair laughing when you accused Patrick of stretching the truth. Something about the pot calling the kettle black came to mind.

You are right though, this thread is dead. You have proved to all of us that you are a legend in your own mind and will defend your right to deny a refund to anyone who is entitled to it. Please take some of the $300 per hour you feel you are entitled to and go back to primary school and brush up on the spelling and grammar. A ripoff defense is held in much higher esteem when it is understandable. I must admit to giving up on some of your rants because it was nearly impossible to understand because of misspelling. Cheer up, chill out and remember the best ten years of your life - they were spent in the 5th grade!!!

Treat your customers as you would like to be treated yourself and you will sleep much better. That, my friend, you can definitely "take to the bank"

Jim,

Never on this report have you come out and said "I am a salesperson for GC&T working as an independent contractor". Even though I have asked you that question several times.

This was the closest you ever came to showing your affiliation:

"I am "like I said" neither an employee nor the owner of the company. However I did have my input into the design. I have advised salespeople. Usually to disclose everything. It's not like GC&T's should be "ripping anyone off".

However, as I said before... all salespeople representing this company are "independant contractors" & it is hard to control what they say. That is why intelligent people like "Chris" who designed the website & people like "Craig" who financed the operation... tried to come up with something "viable & liveable" for most customers. Then they put it in writing."

That answer was about as indirect as they come. Everyone here can see who the liar is (typical used car salesman!) I am finished with your lunacy on this report. Yes, I will let you have the last word. It does not matter to me.

Dear Readers;

I am sure I have answered what I am & who I am & what my interests in GC&T are haven't I? Anyway... who cares? Is it not what I have said that is more important? I think it is & that you "can take to the bank" Adam got the money back that he was overcharged & I think this thread's point is over. We have gone from that, to "how some people think GC&T should get customers", to how some vehicles are posted in other States & Provinces & why, to an explanation on how & why the website works to, who works there & who does not, to what they look like, to their names, to where people keep their money... I am sure we are way "off subject" by now. Maybe the next question will be as to what color my eyes are.

Is there anyone out there that is confused? Something anyone is missing? I have answered every question asked. Asked if I was an employee of GC&T, I said no. Asked if I am an independant contractor. I said yes. Asked if I worked out of any of GC&T's offices. I said no. Asked if I have had or do have any dealings with GC&T. I said yes. If I was asked if I ever raised business for GC&T the answer would be yes. If asked have I ever earned any money from my efforts with GC&T, my answer would also be yes. What else can I say?

Now if you "get it"... & you compleatly understand... then please tell me. What does that have to do with the price of cheese? For that matter what does that have to do with Adam's case or anyone elses case that has filed "rip off reports" here? Would you be with me if I exclaimed "Nothing"?

Nothing dear reader & you can take that "to the bank".

once again, Jim, you have failed to answer the simple question put to you. Nowhere in that long diatribe did you ever state whether or not you were an "independent contractor" or "commissioned salesperson" for GC&T. All you have said is that you are a salesperson with "multiple interests".

Why do you keep dodging that question? Do you have something to hide?

C'mon Jim, give us a simple yes or no answer. Stop writing these long boring diatribes aimed at trying to misdirect this conversation.

One simple answer. Yes or no. Are you a salesperson for GC&T, whether it be by direct employment, or through contract?

once again, Jim, you have failed to answer the simple question put to you. Nowhere in that long diatribe did you ever state whether or not you were an "independent contractor" or "commissioned salesperson" for GC&T. All you have said is that you are a salesperson with "multiple interests".

Why do you keep dodging that question? Do you have something to hide?

C'mon Jim, give us a simple yes or no answer. Stop writing these long boring diatribes aimed at trying to misdirect this conversation.

One simple answer. Yes or no. Are you a salesperson for GC&T, whether it be by direct employment, or through contract?

once again, Jim, you have failed to answer the simple question put to you. Nowhere in that long diatribe did you ever state whether or not you were an "independent contractor" or "commissioned salesperson" for GC&T. All you have said is that you are a salesperson with "multiple interests".

Why do you keep dodging that question? Do you have something to hide?

C'mon Jim, give us a simple yes or no answer. Stop writing these long boring diatribes aimed at trying to misdirect this conversation.

One simple answer. Yes or no. Are you a salesperson for GC&T, whether it be by direct employment, or through contract?

once again, Jim, you have failed to answer the simple question put to you. Nowhere in that long diatribe did you ever state whether or not you were an "independent contractor" or "commissioned salesperson" for GC&T. All you have said is that you are a salesperson with "multiple interests".

Why do you keep dodging that question? Do you have something to hide?

C'mon Jim, give us a simple yes or no answer. Stop writing these long boring diatribes aimed at trying to misdirect this conversation.

One simple answer. Yes or no. Are you a salesperson for GC&T, whether it be by direct employment, or through contract?

Dear Readers;

If any of you are working, you are dealing with one of "2" industries. You are either (a) Manufacturing a product or (b) doing a service. In either situation, you would not be working, would not be earning money, could not pay your bills if a salesman did not sell your product or service.

Some people hate salesmen. I find that rediculous. Around 10 years ago Sears Corperation decided they could not afford to keep their "commission salespeople" who sold appliances, as they did not want to pay for their vacations or retirement anymore. Who looses? You do the consumer.

If I want to buy a new "stove or fridge", & I am wanting to pay that kind of money for a new one... I want a "knowledgeable salesperson" to guide me in my purchase. Commission salespeople "know their product or service" as they have a "direct interest" in it. They become "good salespeople" only by learning their product & being able to handle "objections".

Although many people will not admit it, most people "like to be sold", as they wish to have quality for what they are buying. They want to make sure that "their hard earned money" is being spent in the direction of someone who is "genuinely working" to make it an easy transaction.

Well I am "proud to say" that I am a commission salesperson. I refuse to work by the hour. I have been asked to "demand my price" for an hourly pay rate, as it would be met. My reply? $300.00 per hour! No company I have dealt with could afford that amount.

Instead I do what I do best. I make the company money. I keep people employed. I support the houses & cars & the 2.2 children. I am a commission salesperson & d**n proud of it!

I have explained before my interest in GC&T. I have made it "quite clear" that I was "part of" & proud to be part of the "original idea" which has been proven to be very successful.

You may not like how salesmen sell. For example your cable company has an ad for a "free month" of cable. Now of course you need to purchase "other months" to get that free month, but that is not how they sell it. They don't say "Pay up front for 3 months & we will give you your 4th month free" do they? No! Simply because it is not as attractive as saying "Get a free month from XYZ cable... call us today!".

Well GC&T salespeople say "We Guarantee you a buyer, or your money back!". That is no more a lie than the free month. There are conditions that must be followed. Any "smart consumer" should know that.

When I sold newspapers, I trained salespeople to offer the customer "free weekdays". Not "Pay for the weekend paper & get the weekdays for free!" Those that used that approach sold less than 1/2 of the subscriptions that my salespeople sold as "free weekdays" is a better opener. Believe me... no customer who bought from my salespeople ever had trouble understanding that they had paid a discount rate for the newspaper on a "trial basis" when my salesperson had gone. Anyone who would have approached the sale with "Hey... want the newspaper for 3 months for 30 bucks?" would have not made enough money to survive. Presentation is everything.

As a "good salesperson" I refuse to sell "anything" I do not personally believe in. I will advise any "good salesperson" to give GC&T a go. It is an honest service, at a decent price, with a fair guarantee. This week they are launching a magazine that will be available in stores for "free". Now take that competition! You charge for yours don't you?

Before GC&T came along, if you wanted to sell your vehicle, you had few choices. The people who would place an ad for you would mix you in with dealers for a price & they hoped your vehicle "did not sell", as then they would get you to pay more money to place another ad again. Then after months of spending money placing your ad & paying money "hand over fist" doing that, you would usually "give up". However these companies are not stupid & would catch you before you turned it into a dealer.

They own "other publications" & would have these call you for 1 more try. Hey... "once a sucker... always a sucker eh?" Once you were "totally frustrated" they would finally sell your phone number to the dealer, who would only take a few thousand dollars more to put your vehicle on their lot!

Thousands of dollars later, you would be finally rid of your vehicle. Everyone was smileing all the way through the process, as they took your "hard earned cash". No they did not have to call you. They did not have to have "good commission salespeople". They did not have to spend 1/2 hour on the phone with you explaining their service. They were the "only game going". You "Mr Sucker" called them.

GC&T saw a "nitch" & thought of a website that would only charge you once. Proof that they had no "alterior motives" but to sell your vehicle, & arranged financing for people who wanted to buy your vehicle. Knowing this would be successful, they offered a "money back guarantee". Great concept!

It also worked! As you can see by the amount of vehicles for sale "presently" on the site. The people who set this up also knew that the best advertising was "word of mouth" & that worked too! It worked for all but the 0.0018% of the people who do not "get it" & are lost enough to write "rip off reports".

As a "commission salesperson" I do not "limit myself" to promoting only 1 thing at a time. I have more than one sales interest. However I never will be "anyone's employee". I will only promote a "good product or service" & I refuse to lie. Anyone who would ask me about this guarantee, I would direct to the website, where it is written clearly. I don't see where GC&T should have "anything to hide".

They have nothing to be ashamed of.

Jim,

You are nothing but a piss ant used car salesman hack. I don't care if you are a direct employee, or an "independent contractor". A slimy salesman is a slimy salesman.

Yes, I am directly responding to you this time. I won't try to p***y foot around smeantics as you are.

So come on Jim. Be absolutely truthful. What is your affiliation with GC&T? Are you an "independent contractor" who cold calls people who have placed an ad in the Auto Trader? Be honest now. We all know the truth anyway.

Dear Reader;

If you are still reading this, I would suggest you find something else to do. Clearly this has turned into a "spit campaign" & it does not have very much revelence to the case.

Definition: Employees are paid by the company they work for & "directly represent the company". Independant Contractors work for "themselves" & are not guided by anything else but their own morals.

Anyone who claims to be an "ex employee" or even an "employee" of a company that is not, is definately making a "legal mistake" along with a "moral one". They are also not telling the truth if they are an independant contractor. If that is their "opening line" you can give as much creedence to the rest of what they have to say. More if they end without identifing themselves.

Independant Contractors do usually work on a "commission basis", yes! Simply because you could not hire people by the hour to make the amount of sales that an "Independant Contractor" can, as their only income is from their results. Not from their time put in not producing anything.

Independant Contractors are held by the "laws of the land" as well, & if they do something "fraudulent", they can be charged criminally. Usually people who commit frauds are found out early & "the company" will refuse future submissions from them as well as contact the Police. Rarely therefore do you get a "good independant contractor" who is willing to lie or commit frauds. Using a "credit card twice" for an example is a fraudulent act & can be detected usually within a 1 months period. The customer never looses when they detect this & the person responsible is usually out of work & shortly in jail.

Companies who operate in Canada which are registered, (as GC&T is) are monitored as to what can & "can not" be constituted as a fraud. Those who are blatent about it, have their licence to operate taken away. It is almost impossible for such a company to commit fraud "on a regular basis" & still be in business after 3 years. Therefore the Company must be concerned with the kind of "Independant Contractors" they hire & the quality of their work. Fraud is an easy thing to prove when you have a "written" money back guarntee & you are taking payment from customers from Visa & Mastercard. Just the "latter companies" mentioned have their own "fraud departments" & can refuse their service to anyone if they feel the company is not using "fair business practices".

I take an issue with "liars" that say they were employees when they were not. I take issue with people who claim things that are not the policy, or policies that are now. These have been combatted against in the past as they will be in the future. I take an issue with people who "bad mouth" a company that they either "gained money from" in the past, or that they have absolutely no interest in, other than to stir up trouble. Expecially when they "make up facts" or blatently lie as some people have done here.

The facts speak for themselves. GT&C is a very big website. It has many vehicles on it. You would be "hard pressed" to find anyone who is listed on it that would claim they were "double or triple charged" on their credit card for their ad.

Listing a vehicle in "any venue" is a gamble. Having "any kind of guarantee" is better than none. Financing is a "bonus" that most other venue's do not offer. Even when they do, the financing is usually limited to what you could get at your own bank.

You can spell it "any way you wish". You can judge a salesman on his looks, even though anyone who knows of me knows that I personally do not work at either GC&T office & so if they claimed to know my looks, that would also be a lie.

There is only one thing to decide. Do you still want to sell your item? If so "are you happy" using the venue you have been using? If not... after a "good salesman" explains it to you, you may decide to try a differnt forum. If so... each forum has different advantages. GC&T might be right for you. Expecially if you are tired of spending "more money" every 2 weeks to list.

Now as some other person said who was not true to their word... you can "take that to the bank".

Dear Readers (sound familiar Jim?),

It's obvious to see that Jim has reading comprehension problems. He didn't see that my response was not directed to him. It is also clear that he is a liar and cannot be trusted.

Let's examine, shall we? First, on 6/10/05 Jim says:

"Until then... any more post's from you will be ignored by me."

Lie #1.

Then, on 6/13/05 he said:

"I am "like I said" neither an employee nor the owner of the company."

Lie #2, according to the post by the former employee. And yes, I count "Independent Contractor" as employee.

So yes, let's let the readers decide.

Dear Reader;

Again you can trust someone who makes promises that you can "take to the bank". You decide reader. You decide.

All I can say is, WOW! Very enlightening stuff there former employee. But, I am sure Jim will come back and say that this is just a disgruntled former employee who got canned for one reason or another, and they are just trying to get back at GC&T.

But the one thing you can't ignore is how true this information rings with the various posts about this company. Overcharged billing, impossible to get refunds, can't get answers on the phone, etc.

And by the way (Jim), this is not a response to Jim, as previously I said I was done with him on this post.

I will be sure to post a link to this report on all the other reports about GC&T.

After reading the posting from 'anonymous' the ex-employee we have a real dilemna don't we? It is hard to imagine that James has been lying to his captivated audience for all this time - he's such a standup guy!!
Why would an ex employee have harsh words for such a wonderful company - as James describes it GC&T is the only advertising business on the planet that people should use. Albeit you won't sell your vehicle nor get a promised refund but you will become cannon fodder for James' derisive tongue.
My vote is for 'anonymous' Patrick - how about you? James, I think the truth is emerging, finally, so why not give up while you are so far behind in the credibility stakes before anonymous and other exemployees tell us the whole truth about you and your unethical ways. Not one person with an IQ above their shoe size could read all of your postings and believe anything you have written other than your name is James or Jim. You have no intention of giving or assisting anyone to get a refund so give it up and get a real job! Join the human race.

Hi everyone.

I am a former employee of Great Cars and Trucks. I will not disclose my name as I don't want anyone from Great Cars and Trucks to be calling me and wondering why I am writing this. But I assure you, I worked there long enough to realize that it was a scam and I am able to answer all questions you might have. There are so many things that were said that I can explain to all of you. I am writing this because I believe that this scam has been going on for way too long and I honestly feel sorry for anyone who deals with Great Cars and Trucks.

To Adam, first of all, I am sorry you got ripped off. You are definately not the first to be overcharged by this company. I am actually quite surprised that you DID get your refund, most OVERCHARGED customers don't.

The reason you might have been overcharged is because the employees of this company work on strictly commission. The more credit cards they hand in, the more commission they get. So some of them seem to put in the customer's credit card on different ads just to get paid for more than one ad. The commission is 40% of the ad's worth. So if your ad is $100, the salesperson gets $40. Now if he hands it in 3 times, that's $40 * 3. You see what I mean?

Another reason you might have been overcharged is because they secretaries that work at Great Cars and Trucks are young, ignorant girls who are just there for a paycheck. Mistakes like double or triple billing used to happen all the time. They don't actually have a department for billing, it's just one or two girls who handle that. You see, Great Cars and Trucks isn't this big company that everyone thinks it is. It's just a small company with stereotypical telemarketers and a few secretaries who handle all the administrative work.

James is Jim Stewart. He is a salesperson that works from home. At least that's what he was when I was still working there. I'm surprised he still works there. Get a real job buddy. If you ever see what Jim Stewart looks like, you'll know why all his rebuttals are pointless, but I'm not here to trash anyone's looks. Jim does not get paid to write these reports, he only writes them because he wants to justify why he works at a dishonorable business, and to make himself feel better about scamming people. He can't even spell, that should tell you something. A typo is one thing but not knowing how to spell is another....

Now, why there was no phone number on Adam's ad is simple. It's not because he's trying to hide anything. When you are posting an ad, as Adam said he did himself, there is an option that states: "Do you want your phone number and address to appear on the ad?" Most people put accidentally ignore this option because it's not one of the questions that are erquired. Some people put No because they don't want their address to show on the internet. They don't realize that their phone number will not show too. But that is really not a big issue here.

The accounting department consists of one person. Audrey Schmid. She takes care of the refunds and cancellations. She is Craig McMorran's mother. Craig McMorran is the owner of the company. She does not like to issue refunds and will avoid them as much as she can until some other business is involved, like the BBB or VISA or the cops even. When she absolutely HAS to issue the refund, she will. This is only for people who are overcharged, I'm not even talking about the 90 day Money Back Guarantee. Don't even think about getting your money back when it comes to that. Way too many loop holes!!

Now, why Adam can't get through to Great Cars and Trucks is actually because they did change all their phone numbers. But it is not because of some sort of administrative thing, it's because they were getting way too many complaints there to handle. Running away is their best policy. I believe you Adam when you say you weren't abusive when you called and wanted an explanation why you were charged 3 times. Anyone would be upset if they were overcharged for no reason.

The girls answering the phones receive so many complaints that they have sort of been desensitzed to those kinds of calls. It doesn't phase them any more, they don't care about customer service. They say they will pass on the message but there is no actual manager who deals with these kinds of complaints. I told you it is a small company and everyone is just there to make money, not help people. Their site doesn't even work, nobody sells any vehicles off their site, let along get any calls inquiring about the vehicles. Why do you think they have an unsatisfactory rating with the BBB? Because they run away from their issues. All they care about is taking people's money so that it can go into Craig's offshore account. What are you hiding Craig?

Anyways, that's all I have to say. I can't believe I worked there for as long as I did. I guess good money sucks you in but if you have a conscience you get out soon enough.

Jim, don't reply to this, I never liked you then, I still don't like you now. Go take a shower maybe. The only purpose of this is to tell Adam that he was right. He didn't need to go to VISA to get the money that Great Cars and Trucks OVERCHARGED him. That doesn't even make sense. The only time you go to VISA is to do a chargeback when the actual company doesn't help you and give you the refund.

Great Cars and Trucks is pathetic, somebody needs to shut them down already. This has been going on for over 3 years now. They're just good scam artists.

Cheers.

Hi everyone.

I am a former employee of Great Cars and Trucks. I will not disclose my name as I don't want anyone from Great Cars and Trucks to be calling me and wondering why I am writing this. But I assure you, I worked there long enough to realize that it was a scam and I am able to answer all questions you might have. There are so many things that were said that I can explain to all of you. I am writing this because I believe that this scam has been going on for way too long and I honestly feel sorry for anyone who deals with Great Cars and Trucks.

To Adam, first of all, I am sorry you got ripped off. You are definately not the first to be overcharged by this company. I am actually quite surprised that you DID get your refund, most OVERCHARGED customers don't.

The reason you might have been overcharged is because the employees of this company work on strictly commission. The more credit cards they hand in, the more commission they get. So some of them seem to put in the customer's credit card on different ads just to get paid for more than one ad. The commission is 40% of the ad's worth. So if your ad is $100, the salesperson gets $40. Now if he hands it in 3 times, that's $40 * 3. You see what I mean?

Another reason you might have been overcharged is because they secretaries that work at Great Cars and Trucks are young, ignorant girls who are just there for a paycheck. Mistakes like double or triple billing used to happen all the time. They don't actually have a department for billing, it's just one or two girls who handle that. You see, Great Cars and Trucks isn't this big company that everyone thinks it is. It's just a small company with stereotypical telemarketers and a few secretaries who handle all the administrative work.

James is Jim Stewart. He is a salesperson that works from home. At least that's what he was when I was still working there. I'm surprised he still works there. Get a real job buddy. If you ever see what Jim Stewart looks like, you'll know why all his rebuttals are pointless, but I'm not here to trash anyone's looks. Jim does not get paid to write these reports, he only writes them because he wants to justify why he works at a dishonorable business, and to make himself feel better about scamming people. He can't even spell, that should tell you something. A typo is one thing but not knowing how to spell is another....

Now, why there was no phone number on Adam's ad is simple. It's not because he's trying to hide anything. When you are posting an ad, as Adam said he did himself, there is an option that states: "Do you want your phone number and address to appear on the ad?" Most people put accidentally ignore this option because it's not one of the questions that are erquired. Some people put No because they don't want their address to show on the internet. They don't realize that their phone number will not show too. But that is really not a big issue here.

The accounting department consists of one person. Audrey Schmid. She takes care of the refunds and cancellations. She is Craig McMorran's mother. Craig McMorran is the owner of the company. She does not like to issue refunds and will avoid them as much as she can until some other business is involved, like the BBB or VISA or the cops even. When she absolutely HAS to issue the refund, she will. This is only for people who are overcharged, I'm not even talking about the 90 day Money Back Guarantee. Don't even think about getting your money back when it comes to that. Way too many loop holes!!

Now, why Adam can't get through to Great Cars and Trucks is actually because they did change all their phone numbers. But it is not because of some sort of administrative thing, it's because they were getting way too many complaints there to handle. Running away is their best policy. I believe you Adam when you say you weren't abusive when you called and wanted an explanation why you were charged 3 times. Anyone would be upset if they were overcharged for no reason.

The girls answering the phones receive so many complaints that they have sort of been desensitzed to those kinds of calls. It doesn't phase them any more, they don't care about customer service. They say they will pass on the message but there is no actual manager who deals with these kinds of complaints. I told you it is a small company and everyone is just there to make money, not help people. Their site doesn't even work, nobody sells any vehicles off their site, let along get any calls inquiring about the vehicles. Why do you think they have an unsatisfactory rating with the BBB? Because they run away from their issues. All they care about is taking people's money so that it can go into Craig's offshore account. What are you hiding Craig?

Anyways, that's all I have to say. I can't believe I worked there for as long as I did. I guess good money sucks you in but if you have a conscience you get out soon enough.

Jim, don't reply to this, I never liked you then, I still don't like you now. Go take a shower maybe. The only purpose of this is to tell Adam that he was right. He didn't need to go to VISA to get the money that Great Cars and Trucks OVERCHARGED him. That doesn't even make sense. The only time you go to VISA is to do a chargeback when the actual company doesn't help you and give you the refund.

Great Cars and Trucks is pathetic, somebody needs to shut them down already. This has been going on for over 3 years now. They're just good scam artists.

Cheers.

Hi everyone.

I am a former employee of Great Cars and Trucks. I will not disclose my name as I don't want anyone from Great Cars and Trucks to be calling me and wondering why I am writing this. But I assure you, I worked there long enough to realize that it was a scam and I am able to answer all questions you might have. There are so many things that were said that I can explain to all of you. I am writing this because I believe that this scam has been going on for way too long and I honestly feel sorry for anyone who deals with Great Cars and Trucks.

To Adam, first of all, I am sorry you got ripped off. You are definately not the first to be overcharged by this company. I am actually quite surprised that you DID get your refund, most OVERCHARGED customers don't.

The reason you might have been overcharged is because the employees of this company work on strictly commission. The more credit cards they hand in, the more commission they get. So some of them seem to put in the customer's credit card on different ads just to get paid for more than one ad. The commission is 40% of the ad's worth. So if your ad is $100, the salesperson gets $40. Now if he hands it in 3 times, that's $40 * 3. You see what I mean?

Another reason you might have been overcharged is because they secretaries that work at Great Cars and Trucks are young, ignorant girls who are just there for a paycheck. Mistakes like double or triple billing used to happen all the time. They don't actually have a department for billing, it's just one or two girls who handle that. You see, Great Cars and Trucks isn't this big company that everyone thinks it is. It's just a small company with stereotypical telemarketers and a few secretaries who handle all the administrative work.

James is Jim Stewart. He is a salesperson that works from home. At least that's what he was when I was still working there. I'm surprised he still works there. Get a real job buddy. If you ever see what Jim Stewart looks like, you'll know why all his rebuttals are pointless, but I'm not here to trash anyone's looks. Jim does not get paid to write these reports, he only writes them because he wants to justify why he works at a dishonorable business, and to make himself feel better about scamming people. He can't even spell, that should tell you something. A typo is one thing but not knowing how to spell is another....

Now, why there was no phone number on Adam's ad is simple. It's not because he's trying to hide anything. When you are posting an ad, as Adam said he did himself, there is an option that states: "Do you want your phone number and address to appear on the ad?" Most people put accidentally ignore this option because it's not one of the questions that are erquired. Some people put No because they don't want their address to show on the internet. They don't realize that their phone number will not show too. But that is really not a big issue here.

The accounting department consists of one person. Audrey Schmid. She takes care of the refunds and cancellations. She is Craig McMorran's mother. Craig McMorran is the owner of the company. She does not like to issue refunds and will avoid them as much as she can until some other business is involved, like the BBB or VISA or the cops even. When she absolutely HAS to issue the refund, she will. This is only for people who are overcharged, I'm not even talking about the 90 day Money Back Guarantee. Don't even think about getting your money back when it comes to that. Way too many loop holes!!

Now, why Adam can't get through to Great Cars and Trucks is actually because they did change all their phone numbers. But it is not because of some sort of administrative thing, it's because they were getting way too many complaints there to handle. Running away is their best policy. I believe you Adam when you say you weren't abusive when you called and wanted an explanation why you were charged 3 times. Anyone would be upset if they were overcharged for no reason.

The girls answering the phones receive so many complaints that they have sort of been desensitzed to those kinds of calls. It doesn't phase them any more, they don't care about customer service. They say they will pass on the message but there is no actual manager who deals with these kinds of complaints. I told you it is a small company and everyone is just there to make money, not help people. Their site doesn't even work, nobody sells any vehicles off their site, let along get any calls inquiring about the vehicles. Why do you think they have an unsatisfactory rating with the BBB? Because they run away from their issues. All they care about is taking people's money so that it can go into Craig's offshore account. What are you hiding Craig?

Anyways, that's all I have to say. I can't believe I worked there for as long as I did. I guess good money sucks you in but if you have a conscience you get out soon enough.

Jim, don't reply to this, I never liked you then, I still don't like you now. Go take a shower maybe. The only purpose of this is to tell Adam that he was right. He didn't need to go to VISA to get the money that Great Cars and Trucks OVERCHARGED him. That doesn't even make sense. The only time you go to VISA is to do a chargeback when the actual company doesn't help you and give you the refund.

Great Cars and Trucks is pathetic, somebody needs to shut them down already. This has been going on for over 3 years now. They're just good scam artists.

Cheers.

Dear Patrick;

The magazines like the "Auto Trader" are filled mostly with dealers. When people are buying these magazines they are not looking for dealer ad's but private sales. However this is what they are faced with. Dealer ad's gallore.

Now there is a "good reason" why they like dealer ads, as they have more vehicles to advertize. The dealers do not want these magazines to offer financing, as that is "their business" & where they make "their money". So both companies work "hand & hand" hoping that your vehicle does not sell through that medium. Then when you get "sick & tired" listing with them, these magazines usually own other ones as well, who they get to call you up & offer you a different deal. Once you are tired with them, your phone number is sold to the dealer, who offers you "pennies on the dollar" for your vehicle.

So it is in "my mind" these people who are getting "ripped off" & if a sales rep from GC&T can get to them before they are compleatly broke, they might be able to save these people from getting "ripped off".

So no, they will not stop saving people money & giving them alternatives. They will not stop explaining to people that they need financing backing them up to sell the average vehicle.

GC&T will continue to contact these "lost souls" advertizing in the Traders & the Newspapers where they do these things to them, & hopefully be able to save many customers time & money.

That is how you run a business.

Quote: "Hey I might have even got Patrick to change his mind, but the way GC&T does business will not change. The competition "is" the guys who "rip people off". Whether it be the newspapers or the magazines."

James, if that is the way Craig truly feels, then I can say with surety that I will never use the services of GC&T. I tried to be fair and understanding, but you don't seem to care.

Any business that refuses to change based on the needs or the wants of the customer will not last. Or at least they won't have great success.

Now James says the newspapers and magazines are the ones ripping off the consumer. How is that James? Are they charging more than industry average (notice I said Industry Average)for ads? Can you prove this?

You know what, never mind. I have grown tired of the same old response from you. I am done with this topic, and will not respond to you any further. You can take that to the bank.

Dear Readers;

Hey I might have even got Patrick to change his mind, but the way GC&T does business will not change. The competition "is" the guys who "rip people off". Whether it be the newspapers or the magazines.

These publications hope you list with them & hope you do not sell... so you will "re list" again. When you are finally broke... they will have the dealer call ya up to give ya "pennies on the dollar" for all you have left.

They don't offer financing in these publications for a good reason. Most of their ad's are dealer ad's. The dealers have their own financing & that is where they make their money. So you are "fresh meat to be exploited" the moment you place an ad.

GC&T does "not" make any money extra if you do not sell. Their only goal is to sell your vehicle. However inperfect they may be... they do give refunds & they try not to rip you off.

I hope this posts in the correct order. If not, read "My final words to James" first.

James,

I know that I have been harsh in my responses to you. I hope that my last post will show that I can also be understanding.

The harshness in my posts comes from your initial response to Adam, and your "not our problem" attitude that came through on your post (even if that was not your intention).

Hey, I might even reconsider using GC&T sometime in the future, but we will have to see if and when that time comes.

OK James, you had a hand in the creation of the website, and you know the owner. You come here to defend a legitimate business. I think I can live with that.

But again, I have never come out and said that GC&T is a rip off, or that people don't get a refund after 90 days. All of my comments were either specifically to this report, or to respond to posts you put on other reports. The information about the BBB was cut and pasted directly from the Reliability Report. BBB's words, not mine.

As I had said before, GC&T seems to be a viable alternative to conventional advertising, and the business model is sound. However, I have a few suggestions for the future that you may want to pass on the Craig:

1) Get a grip on the sales force. Make sure they are conveying the full and correct information to the customer. This is the most important as the sales force is usually the only contact most clients have with GC&T, and success depnds mostly on them.

2) Be more responsive to customer complaints such as Adam's. His situation should have called for an immediate contact from GC&T and a refund of the additional charges incorrectly charged to his VISA. This is almost as important, if not as important, as #1.

3) Stop surfing the conventional ads and cold-calling potential clients. A lot of scam businesses work this way. Just look at the Help Wanted websites.

4) I understand that GC&T requires a certain amount of security regarding whether or not a customer is truly due a refund if their vehicle does not sell in 90 days. But be more up front with them about the requirements to get that refund. Even with this knowledge, you will still get a good customer base.

In the end, these suggestions will help GC&T grow to be a better company overall.

Dear Readers;

I am "like I said" neither an employee nor the owner of the company. However I did have my input into the design. I have advised salespeople. Usually to disclose everything. It's not like GC&T's should be "ripping anyone off".

However, as I said before... all salespeople representing this company are "independant contractors" & it is hard to control what they say. That is why intelligent people like "Chris" who designed the website & people like "Craig" who financed the operation... tried to come up with something "viable & liveable" for most customers. Then they put it in writing.

The financing was the key. Set up, it can move more vehicles than any other medium. With this key... the "Money Back Guarantee" could be put in place with confidence.

In some ways a "downfall", as people now had reason to complain. However when you go to a store & even get a coupon, it has a expiry date. Same thing here. All businesseses operate in the same way.,

You may have a guarantee... but it has conditions. Now in this case, the rules are a little hard to live by, cause you have to have proof & it must be in a timely period. Knowing the competition charges close to the same amount for a 2 week ad, the people at GC&T decided that 7 days after the 90 day run was fair.

Now... sorry if I feel this not only legitamate, but I also find it insulting if someone complains after GC&T has never tried to hide this fact.

Vehicles are listed in more than one Province or State, as per the Customers request. They pay extra for that.

No one is trying to "rip off" anyone here. The people at GC&T's are just running a business. They do work every day trying to get more lenders & they "bend over backwards" to make sure people know how to edit their ads. There are limits.

I am a salesman. I have sold suits & shoes & sewing machines & cars... I have sold the Ginsu Knife & the Shammy. I have sold Newspapers all over this Continent. I have sold Oil Changes "door to door" & I will not sell anything I don't personally believe in!

I Believe in Great Cars & Trucks! I hate companies who "rip you off" knowing you will not sell your vehicle & then selling your name to the dealer after they have "raped as much money as they can out of you".

So I agreed to help with GC&T for that reason. Not for money! Just because it was a "Great Concept" & something I could be proud of.

I have spent years in training for sales. Books Tapes & Seminars. If people are confused... I am no kid. I turn 47 in July. Certainly there are people out there that will "rip you off"... but they don't last long. Never 3 or more years! They are also not good salesmen, because good salesmen understand that what they do today, will reflect back on them in their future. It will also reflect back on the company they represent.

I defend this company because I believe in it & I had a part in it's beginning. I defend this company because I think it to be "the best of the best" & I know the owner. I highly respect him! He never premotes lieing or not giving people all the information.

A few people "put their heads together" & came up with this website. Some of the "best salesmen" I have ever known! Honest to the core! Great people!

Oh & it has had it's growing pains! That is for sure. It is also true that "sometimes" there are salespeople that come in that do not give "all the information" to the customer. Unfortunately this is true.

However I am so sure of this company... that I predict that it will take over the market & become the biggest website in history, next to Google & Yahoo! You may laugh at that. You may snicker. However it is over the 3 year mark! 2 more years & I think it made home base.

So in the meantime... when you get "really pissed" that your car did not sell & you did not follow the instructions for getting the money back... just know your vehicle will continue to be there & financing available... as soon as you find someone serious. If you can wait that long before turning it into a dealer.

To show who is really telling the truth

James, there you go again putting words in my mouth. Never have I said that GC&T was a rip off, or that it did not work, or that people do not ever get their money back if their vehicle does not sell in 90 days. I challenge you to prove otherwise.

proof:
From all of your posts defending this company, it's hard to tell. And I must say, you are not representing them in a good light. If the guarantee says sold in 90 days or your money back, then customers should be able to get their refund, instead of "You got a great deal for 90 days of advertising, even though your car (or sawmill) didn't sell, so we won't refund your money, even though we advertise sold in 90 days or your money back".

Oh, and here is something I have never commented on before. I went to the GC&T website the other day and looked it over for a while. It looks like a viable alternative to the other venues, and the business model is sound. And the site says for a one-time flat fee (usually $99) you can have one ad with up to 4 pics for as long as it takes to sell your vehicle. Money back guarantee if it does not sell in 90 days (provided you follow ALL of the directions for doing so). I have seen you comment on other reports that you do customers "a favor" by letting them keep their ad posted past the initial 90 days. But wait, that is already provided for, so what "favor" are you talking about?

Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record with the Bureau due to failure to respond to one or more complaints and or two or more otherwise unresolved complaints. However the business has resolved most complaints presented to the bureau. refund issues. Consumers are advised to review the company's criteria for refunds on its website at www.greatcarsandtrucks.com "

Hmmm. Failure to respond and unresolved complaints, mostly dealing with refunds. Something is amiss here. Resolved complaints? Yeah, probably based on the BBB's rules that if you reply, no matter how you reply, they will say resolved. Somehow, I highly doubt the complaintants feel the issue was resolved.

Tell me... is this a lie?

Rebuttal Consumer Comment
Submitted: 6/9/2005 4:53:37 PM Modified: 6/9/2005 4:53:37 PM

Two numbers to try.


Adam,

I don't know if you've tried these yet, and I know they are long distance, but try calling:

780-669-2742, or
403-210-2277

I did some browsing of their website. I thought it funny that when I searched the Alberta region for a "2000 Cavalier", and asked to return search results with those exact words, I got a few RVs and 5th wheels. And half the cars were not even put into the proper category. One Cavalier was listed under Trucks & SUVs.

How funny.

I also found your ad. Only found one for you, not 3. Seems to me like GC&T owes you some money back.

Patrick - Gilbert, Arizona
U.S.A.

His words not mine reader. I condenced version for you to read. Now you tell me... who is being honest?

James (or whoever the hell you are),

What, specifically, is your affiliation with GC&T. Once again, you have failed to answer that simple question. So what is it? Owner? Salesman? Independent Contractor? Personal website advocate? Company shill?

C'mon, you've sidestepped the question long enough. Time to come clean.

You ask why I am here? Let me tell you. About a year ago, I got ripped off by a business in Scottsdale (suburb of Phoenix). With the assistance of this website, and the RipOff Revenge Guide, I was able to get my money back.

I have since become an unofficial consumer advocate. I offer my advice and opinions on topics that I have knowledge of.

So why did I post on this report if I have never used GC&T? Simple. Your initial response to Adam was wrong. He should not have had to work through VISA to get his OVERCHARGED funds back from GC&T. GC&T should have simply responded to his calls and emails about the situation.

Again, either tell us of your affiliation, or stop posting and wasting our time.

Oh, and as long as we're quoting prior posts, here's one from James to me from 2 days ago:

"...any more post's (sic) from you will be ignored by me."

It does appear that hundreds of millions of people are wrong and out to get Great Cars And Trucks and he alone is the perfect businessman who has to protect Great Cars And Trucks from these evil people who try to get refunds that they are entitled to.

This man is a businessman? Let's hear again from him:

Thanks for the entertainment James - I'm glad you've shown we mere mortals how totally inflexible you are.

And Again:

I have a business to run so I won't waste any more time on young James (I say young because of the atrocious spelling and grammar and lack of business acumen) and just so you know James I have been in sales longer than you have been walking so I do understand how to treat customers ethically.

Hmm... heard enough? This is a salesman? The biggest sales book of all time is "How to Win Friends & Influence People" & I think you would be "hard pressed" to find a chapter that would advise you to speak in such a manner if you were trying to influence someone. So if that is what this man is trying to do... he certainly does not know much of sales.

Now does this guy have a personal complaint with GC&T where he himself is in "any way affected"? No. Why is he writing this? Now your guess is as good as mine. Readers this was Wally. Now would you want to do business with a man as insulting as he? Would you find someone as obviously demeaning he is, someone you wanted to work for or take sales advise from? Is he someone you would want to have as a friend? Oh he has a friend... someone just like him named Patrick. This guy wrote his own "rip off report" but doesn't even live in this Continent. He does not have a vehicle on the site & most likely will never need to use the site even to buy. Why is he writing stuff like this?

If you understand how silly it is to even read his stuff... then I would just "by pass" reading anything that comes from Wally. You might also do the same thing with anything written by Patrick.

It does appear that hundreds of millions of people are wrong and out to get Great Cars And Trucks and he alone is the perfect businessman who has to protect Great Cars And Trucks from these evil people who try to get refunds that they are entitled to.

This man is a businessman? Let's hear again from him:

Thanks for the entertainment James - I'm glad you've shown we mere mortals how totally inflexible you are.

And Again:

I have a business to run so I won't waste any more time on young James (I say young because of the atrocious spelling and grammar and lack of business acumen) and just so you know James I have been in sales longer than you have been walking so I do understand how to treat customers ethically.

Hmm... heard enough? This is a salesman? The biggest sales book of all time is "How to Win Friends & Influence People" & I think you would be "hard pressed" to find a chapter that would advise you to speak in such a manner if you were trying to influence someone. So if that is what this man is trying to do... he certainly does not know much of sales.

Now does this guy have a personal complaint with GC&T where he himself is in "any way affected"? No. Why is he writing this? Now your guess is as good as mine. Readers this was Wally. Now would you want to do business with a man as insulting as he? Would you find someone as obviously demeaning he is, someone you wanted to work for or take sales advise from? Is he someone you would want to have as a friend? Oh he has a friend... someone just like him named Patrick. This guy wrote his own "rip off report" but doesn't even live in this Continent. He does not have a vehicle on the site & most likely will never need to use the site even to buy. Why is he writing stuff like this?

If you understand how silly it is to even read his stuff... then I would just "by pass" reading anything that comes from Wally. You might also do the same thing with anything written by Patrick.

It does appear that hundreds of millions of people are wrong and out to get Great Cars And Trucks and he alone is the perfect businessman who has to protect Great Cars And Trucks from these evil people who try to get refunds that they are entitled to.

This man is a businessman? Let's hear again from him:

Thanks for the entertainment James - I'm glad you've shown we mere mortals how totally inflexible you are.

And Again:

I have a business to run so I won't waste any more time on young James (I say young because of the atrocious spelling and grammar and lack of business acumen) and just so you know James I have been in sales longer than you have been walking so I do understand how to treat customers ethically.

Hmm... heard enough? This is a salesman? The biggest sales book of all time is "How to Win Friends & Influence People" & I think you would be "hard pressed" to find a chapter that would advise you to speak in such a manner if you were trying to influence someone. So if that is what this man is trying to do... he certainly does not know much of sales.

Now does this guy have a personal complaint with GC&T where he himself is in "any way affected"? No. Why is he writing this? Now your guess is as good as mine. Readers this was Wally. Now would you want to do business with a man as insulting as he? Would you find someone as obviously demeaning he is, someone you wanted to work for or take sales advise from? Is he someone you would want to have as a friend? Oh he has a friend... someone just like him named Patrick. This guy wrote his own "rip off report" but doesn't even live in this Continent. He does not have a vehicle on the site & most likely will never need to use the site even to buy. Why is he writing stuff like this?

If you understand how silly it is to even read his stuff... then I would just "by pass" reading anything that comes from Wally. You might also do the same thing with anything written by Patrick.

James, there you go again putting words in my mouth. Never have I said that GC&T was a rip off, or that it did not work, or that people do not ever get their money back if their vehicle does not sell in 90 days. I challenge you to prove otherwise.

proof:
From all of your posts defending this company, it's hard to tell. And I must say, you are not representing them in a good light. If the guarantee says sold in 90 days or your money back, then customers should be able to get their refund, instead of "You got a great deal for 90 days of advertising, even though your car (or sawmill) didn't sell, so we won't refund your money, even though we advertise sold in 90 days or your money back".

Oh, and here is something I have never commented on before. I went to the GC&T website the other day and looked it over for a while. It looks like a viable alternative to the other venues, and the business model is sound. And the site says for a one-time flat fee (usually $99) you can have one ad with up to 4 pics for as long as it takes to sell your vehicle. Money back guarantee if it does not sell in 90 days (provided you follow ALL of the directions for doing so). I have seen you comment on other reports that you do customers "a favor" by letting them keep their ad posted past the initial 90 days. But wait, that is already provided for, so what "favor" are you talking about?

Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record with the Bureau due to failure to respond to one or more complaints and or two or more otherwise unresolved complaints. However the business has resolved most complaints presented to the bureau. refund issues. Consumers are advised to review the company's criteria for refunds on its website at www.greatcarsandtrucks.com "

Hmmm. Failure to respond and unresolved complaints, mostly dealing with refunds. Something is amiss here. Resolved complaints? Yeah, probably based on the BBB's rules that if you reply, no matter how you reply, they will say resolved. Somehow, I highly doubt the complaintants feel the issue was resolved.

Tell me... is this a lie?

Rebuttal Consumer Comment
Submitted: 6/9/2005 4:53:37 PM Modified: 6/9/2005 4:53:37 PM

Two numbers to try.


Adam,

I don't know if you've tried these yet, and I know they are long distance, but try calling:

780-669-2742, or
403-210-2277

I did some browsing of their website. I thought it funny that when I searched the Alberta region for a "2000 Cavalier", and asked to return search results with those exact words, I got a few RVs and 5th wheels. And half the cars were not even put into the proper category. One Cavalier was listed under Trucks & SUVs.

How funny.

I also found your ad. Only found one for you, not 3. Seems to me like GC&T owes you some money back.

Patrick - Gilbert, Arizona
U.S.A.

His words not mine reader. I condenced version for you to read. Now you tell me... who is being honest?

James,

Several times the question of your affiliation with GC&T has been posed to you, and all you have done is sidestep that question. I think in one post you said you were an "Independent Contractor". On another post, someone said they called GC&T and spoke to a salesman named "James".

You have intimate knowledge of the workings of GC&T. So much so that you were aware of the phone problems.

You have proven yourself to be a liar by continually posting to this report, long after you said you would stop.

You have proven yourself deceitful by pasting Adam's post about his refund on another report that was dealing with refunds for the 90 day guarantee (Adam's post has nothing to do with the 90 day guarantee refund). And also by not divulging your affiliation with GC&T.

I think Adam's observation is correct. I believe you are either:

1) Craig McMorran, owner of GC&T,

or

2) James (Jim) Stewart, high ranking salesman for GC&T.

I saw when the majority of the original reports about GC&T were posted back in the December 2004 timeframe. After reading most of them, I chalked it up to one or more persons who were trying to attack GC&T for whatever reason. My interest came after reading all of your self-rightous rebuttals, and particularly this report as it had nothing to do with the other reports, yet you tried to make it out that way. And your "too bad, so sad" responses to all the posts reflect badly on GC&T.

Grow up, and deal with the dissatisfied customers of GC&T on a professional level. The RipOff Report is a great tool for weeding out the scum of the earth businesses, and it has found you out too.

If I ever decide to sell one of my vehicles myself, you can bet that GC&T will NOT be a place I turn to for advertising.

So long sucker.

James,

Several times the question of your affiliation with GC&T has been posed to you, and all you have done is sidestep that question. I think in one post you said you were an "Independent Contractor". On another post, someone said they called GC&T and spoke to a salesman named "James".

You have intimate knowledge of the workings of GC&T. So much so that you were aware of the phone problems.

You have proven yourself to be a liar by continually posting to this report, long after you said you would stop.

You have proven yourself deceitful by pasting Adam's post about his refund on another report that was dealing with refunds for the 90 day guarantee (Adam's post has nothing to do with the 90 day guarantee refund). And also by not divulging your affiliation with GC&T.

I think Adam's observation is correct. I believe you are either:

1) Craig McMorran, owner of GC&T,

or

2) James (Jim) Stewart, high ranking salesman for GC&T.

I saw when the majority of the original reports about GC&T were posted back in the December 2004 timeframe. After reading most of them, I chalked it up to one or more persons who were trying to attack GC&T for whatever reason. My interest came after reading all of your self-rightous rebuttals, and particularly this report as it had nothing to do with the other reports, yet you tried to make it out that way. And your "too bad, so sad" responses to all the posts reflect badly on GC&T.

Grow up, and deal with the dissatisfied customers of GC&T on a professional level. The RipOff Report is a great tool for weeding out the scum of the earth businesses, and it has found you out too.

If I ever decide to sell one of my vehicles myself, you can bet that GC&T will NOT be a place I turn to for advertising.

So long sucker.

James,

Several times the question of your affiliation with GC&T has been posed to you, and all you have done is sidestep that question. I think in one post you said you were an "Independent Contractor". On another post, someone said they called GC&T and spoke to a salesman named "James".

You have intimate knowledge of the workings of GC&T. So much so that you were aware of the phone problems.

You have proven yourself to be a liar by continually posting to this report, long after you said you would stop.

You have proven yourself deceitful by pasting Adam's post about his refund on another report that was dealing with refunds for the 90 day guarantee (Adam's post has nothing to do with the 90 day guarantee refund). And also by not divulging your affiliation with GC&T.

I think Adam's observation is correct. I believe you are either:

1) Craig McMorran, owner of GC&T,

or

2) James (Jim) Stewart, high ranking salesman for GC&T.

I saw when the majority of the original reports about GC&T were posted back in the December 2004 timeframe. After reading most of them, I chalked it up to one or more persons who were trying to attack GC&T for whatever reason. My interest came after reading all of your self-rightous rebuttals, and particularly this report as it had nothing to do with the other reports, yet you tried to make it out that way. And your "too bad, so sad" responses to all the posts reflect badly on GC&T.

Grow up, and deal with the dissatisfied customers of GC&T on a professional level. The RipOff Report is a great tool for weeding out the scum of the earth businesses, and it has found you out too.

If I ever decide to sell one of my vehicles myself, you can bet that GC&T will NOT be a place I turn to for advertising.

So long sucker.

Rebuttal Consumer Comment
Submitted: 9/30/2004 4:37:44 PM Modified: 9/30/2004 10:44:38 PM

Do us all a favor Brenda and sell your car on Auto Trader and stop bad mouthing a good company


I am a repeat customer at Great Cars and Trucks. I have listed 2 cars my sons motorcycle and a truck and I have sold - 1 of the cars, the motor cycle, and the truck. My total cost $240.00. The money I made of the 3 sales was aprox. $14500.00. It took about 6 months to sell them all but If I would of used the auto trader which I did for a while, it would of cost me about $840.00. I have nothing bad to say about this company and it's unfortunate that some idiot that can't understand a simple money back guarantee can be such a low life and go and post stupid comment about a person named Susan who is just trying to do her job.

You can't please everybody that is true, but you don't have to ruin a good thing for everyone else. Great Cars and Trucks is a legitimate
company with great customer focus and YES they will sell your car, It might not be overnight but who cares for $60.00 you could have your car posted for 5 years if you wanted. No extra fees, you can't go wrong.

Do the math, how much would it cost you if you used Auto Trader at $70.00/biweekly for 5 years?

Rebuttal Consumer Comment
Submitted: 9/30/2004 4:37:44 PM Modified: 9/30/2004 10:44:38 PM

Do us all a favor Brenda and sell your car on Auto Trader and stop bad mouthing a good company


I am a repeat customer at Great Cars and Trucks. I have listed 2 cars my sons motorcycle and a truck and I have sold - 1 of the cars, the motor cycle, and the truck. My total cost $240.00. The money I made of the 3 sales was aprox. $14500.00. It took about 6 months to sell them all but If I would of used the auto trader which I did for a while, it would of cost me about $840.00. I have nothing bad to say about this company and it's unfortunate that some idiot that can't understand a simple money back guarantee can be such a low life and go and post stupid comment about a person named Susan who is just trying to do her job.

You can't please everybody that is true, but you don't have to ruin a good thing for everyone else. Great Cars and Trucks is a legitimate
company with great customer focus and YES they will sell your car, It might not be overnight but who cares for $60.00 you could have your car posted for 5 years if you wanted. No extra fees, you can't go wrong.

Do the math, how much would it cost you if you used Auto Trader at $70.00/biweekly for 5 years?

Dear Adam;

I personally think I have done more to help you than Patrick or Wally (who are simply stirring up trouble), but if you think you have gained from them... I leave you in your fantacy.

I am not the owner of the company or an employee. I explained in my last response to you why I respond to people like you... but as you find Patrick & Wally as friends... I do not think you are able to see what i am doing.

I gave you good advise. I gave you more good advise. I do not think Patrick or Wally gave you any advise that was helpful. However you have a kinship with them & so I will leave you with that.

Again I only wish you a Good Day & hope you sell your car.

Whoa, James, all of a sudden you have all this insider info about how Great Cars and Trucks operates, that they changed their phone company, about their "backlog" ... and yet you claim you're not an employee?

What, do you date the owner's secretary? Or are you a company spy? I think you're THE OWNER of the company.

Why else would you spend so much time defending them? You obviously are hiding something. You still haven't said who you work for, in fact you keep on ignoring that question over and over. I find that very deceitful.

It would have been much nicer if you had sent me an email explaining exactly what you just said in your previous post. It would be nice if you just signed yourself "James, owner of Great Cars and Trucks" or whatever post or financial interest you have in the company.

It would make more sense to go the extra mile and provide Great customer service as well as Great Cars and Trucks, instead of having to do this silly rear-guard damage control on Rip-off.com.

Just some friendly advice.

To Wally and Patrick, thank you for your defense of my position. It was very nice of you! It made me feel better about the whole thing. Wally, it must be awesome to live down under by the sea. I lived in Vancouver for a year, and I miss Kitts beach the most.

Wally,

I almost fell off my chair laughing when I read your post. Hey, who cares what you look like, so long as you get to live at the beach. I am actually originally from Florida. Just moved to Arizona 2 years ago after my wife's father passed so she could be close to her mother.

We will be taking a 2 week holiday back to Florida next week for some well deserved relaxation at the beach. Boy how I miss living close to the water!

Anyways, cheers mate. Enjoy your weekend!

Oh, and James. BTW, Wally and I are definitely not the same person. I don't know why that is such a rampant accusation across the RipOff Report. I look forward to your next post :).

Adam, thank you for setting the record straight.

Dear Adam;

Since this is a "new complaint" & not just a "rehash" of past ones. I will respond.

GC&T changed it's phone company because of problems with it & had to change most of it's numbers. For a matter of a week, it was not rectified, even though they always had their 1-888 number still functional.

However after the week, they had such a "back log" of people to get back to, it took some time to get back to everyone. Emails were the last they dealt with.

The point is that you had your money returned to your Visa within 1 billing period & they apologized for the inconvienience.

No need to split hairs. Visa could have done the job faster.

I just think "Great idea's" deserve back up & this forum is not the proper way to deal with problems. It put's a "bad light" on GC&T which is not necessary. Everyone in the beginning sat down to think of a "better way" of selling vehicles & this is what they came up with.

I wish you luck in selling yours. However I would advise you to list your phone number on your ad, as people who are looking to buy are looking for "immediate results". I would also advise you to use your access code to upload a "superimposed" photo, showing both the outside & the inside. Lastly I would advise you to tell anyone that is interested in your vehicle that they will have "immediate approval" for financing if they apply for it on GC&T's website. Adam... honestly... if they go to the bank to get financing... you will probably loose them.

A car like yours should go quickly. Print off your ad & stick a copy in the window of the Cavalier. just like the dealers do. That will help as well.

Best of luck Adam & have a Great Day!

Dear Adam;

Since this is a "new complaint" & not just a "rehash" of past ones. I will respond.

GC&T changed it's phone company because of problems with it & had to change most of it's numbers. For a matter of a week, it was not rectified, even though they always had their 1-888 number still functional.

However after the week, they had such a "back log" of people to get back to, it took some time to get back to everyone. Emails were the last they dealt with.

The point is that you had your money returned to your Visa within 1 billing period & the apologized for the inconvienience.

No need to split hairs. Visa could have done the job faster.

James, whoever you are, your blatant and inexplicable defense of this company which you claim not to work for, is evidence that you obviously have something to gain from defending these companies.

FOR THE RECORD: Great Cars and Trucks DID NOT provide me with a refund. They credited my account for an overbilling. A refund has to do with a money-back guarantee.

Also FOR THE RECORD: it took me 28 days (from May 11 to June 8) to get ANY RESPONSE from this company. I sent emails to all addresses that I could find, and called all numbers, only one of which was not disconnected. And when I called that number, I received either voice mail or a message saying the "mailbox is full".

I believe the only reason I recieved a credit for being triple-billed is because I filed a complaint with VISA.

And even then, when Great Cars and Trucks sent me an email to advise me of the credit, the return email address was not any address listed on their website.

My main complaint, which still stands, is the abysmal customer service of Great Cars and Trucks, and their unwillingness to respond to my issue.

They could have made it very easy for me to get my money back. Instead they made it extremely difficult. I have dealt with many online companies and purchased many products with no problems. This is the first time I've had a problem.

Well Patrick you were right again - James could not resist having the last say. However he has created another diversion by insinuating that you and I might be one and the same.

My sympathies mate - I'm pretty ugly - so I'm sure your wife would rather retain you but mine would be happy to get rid of me. Life down under is pretty special, we don't have a lot of the problems you guys have. e.g. I think it is apalling that ripoffreport.com does not provide a spell/grammar checker for James.

Hint James - compose your many, many, many, rebuttals in Word - use its spell check and grammar check and then copy and paste into the response box. I know I didn't need to tell you that being the IT guru that you are but perhaps it may assist someone less able than yourself (I guess that is everybody north and south of the equator).

Thanks for the entertainment James - I'm glad you've shown we mere mortals how totally inflexible you are. "Think outside the square??? I think not - I'm James." It is 10am Saturday morning where I am so I am going to walk across to the beach and dip my toes in the Pacific ocean and ponder just what a superior being James really is - I can only dream of achieving such dizzy heights of respect as he. Enjoy your Friday evening guys. Thanks for the brief dialogue Patrick. I'm just sorry that you have come way down to my level in James' eyes. I guess we both have broad shoulders and will just have to live with the shame of it. Life is terrific.

I just knew James couldn't resist posting again. And I can "guarantee" (no pun intended) that he will again, on this report even.

James, there you go again putting words in my mouth. Never have I said that GC&T was a rip off, or that it did not work, or that people do not ever get their money back if their vehicle does not sell in 90 days. I challenge you to prove otherwise.

My only reason for posting on this report was to say that Adam should not have to go to his CC company to get his OVERCHARGED funds back, but it was up to GC&T to refund him because of their honest mistake. That's it. YOU have turned this into a "my opinion is the right one no matter what you say" fest.

Oh, and here is something I have never commented on before. I went to the GC&T website the other day and looked it over for a while. It looks like a viable alternative to the other venues, and the business model is sound. And the site says for a one-time flat fee (usually $99) you can have one ad with up to 4 pics for as long as it takes to sell your vehicle. Money back guarantee if it does not sell in 90 days (provided you follow ALL of the directions for doing so). I have seen you comment on other reports that you do customers "a favor" by letting them keep their ad posted past the initial 90 days. But wait, that is already provided for, so what "favor" are you talking about?

Go to Google. Type in "Great Cars and Trucks". You will see a result for this website, and one for another consumer complaint website. Anyone who wishes to verify this can perform this simple task.

For anyone reading this:

As you can see the customers complaint was eventually dealt with. No company is perfect. Mistakes are made.

As you can also read, there are always people like Patrick & Wally, (possibly the same person) who come on simply to bash. Wally has no complaint, as he does not even live on this continent & Patrick does not even have a vehicle on the site.

Both of them "obviously with nothing better to do" but to bash other companies "for fun". They have picked apart what I have said & tried to put their own slant on things.

EG: I posted on another complaint what is posted here about Adam getting a refund. I showed it as "proof they give refunds".

Both Wally & Patrick pop back & say "well that was not on the 90 day guarntee... so it does not apply" I did not say it was a refund from the 90 day guarantee. They try to make it look as if I am comparing "apples to oranges". Well that is like saying "Bob can't walk & so how can he ever get a job?" Then I show video of Bob walking to the store & these guys pop back with "That does not mean he can walk to work!"

When they are left with nothing else to say... they insult. Claiming my responses to these reports keep the rip off report high in standing on Google, which is not true, as it has been in the same position next to GC&T's since it first appeared with "one complaint" over a year ago. Patrick misleads you on the use of the search enjine. Go ahead & try a search under "all of my keywords" & see for yourself if you get what he said he got. I tried it many times. No Patrick was just stirring up trouble. They attack my spelling & grammar. Folks there is no "spell check" on a rip off report response. However if you read their posts... you would see this as the "pot calling the kettle black"

I am appalled at the kind of complaints here, some of them very nasty. Naming names & phone numbers & calling people all kinds of things. All of them "except for people like Patrick & Wally who have no personal complaint themselves" basically made because they felt they were entitled to a refund, but were not because they did not follow the rules.

The point of the GT&C website is to sell your product. It does as good a job or better than any other venue I know of doing that. Most people would think this site is a bargain compared to the other venues. Yes sometimes mistakes are made. GC&T want's you to sell your product. They have put many things in place to help you do just that. They make no extra money from you re-advertizing & so they gain "nothing" if you are not successful. That in it'self should be reason enough to want to list with them.

No alterior motives. That is what makes the website great. That is why it has grown over the past 4 years from 0- over 50,000 listings. Most people see the value. At this point I am sure they can & may take away the "Money Back Guarantee" & the website would continue to thrive without it. Complaints people make because they "themselves" did not follow the rules are the reason why the ones that "do" follow the rules will then have to suffer. Complaints posted on this website & with the BBB.

I certainly hope it does not come to that. Yet as they say,,,"One bad apple spoils the pot".

As for the reason for this report... it differs. Someone was overcharged & they were refunded their money. Case closed. I hope if you are reading these reports you will see that my responses have been a "full explanation" of how this system works. I usually will try, as in this case to give someone a different way of handleing their problem if they have not been successful so far.

I also hope you will ignore the "Yahoo's" who have nothing better to do but to insult & stir up troble, expecially those who have no personal interest in GC&T other than to harrass & belittle.

Wally,

I will bet even money that "James" will respond again. I don't see how he can resist.

Good on ya mate for your report. I posted a rebuttal there too.

Cheers.

Hi Patrick I have been following your comments to James about Great Cars and Trucks and think you have been most civil and logical. However your opinion differs from that of James so he no longer wishes to reply to you - there is James' way or James' way and no possible other way. He has also sinbinned me for the same reason. I guess you and I just don't understand that a business (Great Cars and Trucks) will promise to refund your hard earned money if your item doesn't sell after 90 days. However if you try to accept this kind offer you will need a degree in small print in order to effectively claim your refund. If you overpay Great Cars and Trucks you will have to fight tooth and nail to get YOUR MONEY back.
James makes the comment "What percentage of people complain in any business? 2% ? 10% ?" which makes me shake my head in disbelief. How could I possibly run a business with that level of dissatisfaction? 50,000 customers every 90 days equates to 1000-5000 complaints every 90 days what a joke!If the complaint level in my business was .002%-.010% I would be mortified. No wonder he can waste so much time on rebuttals - that must be his only job - and he must have a team of people assisting him to dissuade people from asking for refunds.
Anyway, I have a business to run so I won't waste any more time on young James (I say young because of the atrocious spelling and grammar and lack of business acumen) and just so you know James I have been in sales longer than you have been walking so I do understand how to treat customers ethically. Keep up the good work Patrick. Sincere sympathy James - one day you will understand.

Hi Patrick I have been following your comments to James about Great Cars and Trucks and think you have been most civil and logical. However your opinion differs from that of James so he no longer wishes to reply to you - there is James' way or James' way and no possible other way. He has also sinbinned me for the same reason. I guess you and I just don't understand that a business (Great Cars and Trucks) will promise to refund your hard earned money if your item doesn't sell after 90 days. However if you try to accept this kind offer you will need a degree in small print in order to effectively claim your refund. If you overpay Great Cars and Trucks you will have to fight tooth and nail to get YOUR MONEY back.
James makes the comment "What percentage of people complain in any business? 2% ? 10% ?" which makes me shake my head in disbelief. How could I possibly run a business with that level of dissatisfaction? 50,000 customers every 90 days equates to 1000-5000 complaints every 90 days what a joke!If the complaint level in my business was .002%-.010% I would be mortified. No wonder he can waste so much time on rebuttals - that must be his only job - and he must have a team of people assisting him to dissuade people from asking for refunds.
Anyway, I have a business to run so I won't waste any more time on young James (I say young because of the atrocious spelling and grammar and lack of business acumen) and just so you know James I have been in sales longer than you have been walking so I do understand how to treat customers ethically. Keep up the good work Patrick. Sincere sympathy James - one day you will understand.

Hi Patrick I have been following your comments to James about Great Cars and Trucks and think you have been most civil and logical. However your opinion differs from that of James so he no longer wishes to reply to you - there is James' way or James' way and no possible other way. He has also sinbinned me for the same reason. I guess you and I just don't understand that a business (Great Cars and Trucks) will promise to refund your hard earned money if your item doesn't sell after 90 days. However if you try to accept this kind offer you will need a degree in small print in order to effectively claim your refund. If you overpay Great Cars and Trucks you will have to fight tooth and nail to get YOUR MONEY back.
James makes the comment "What percentage of people complain in any business? 2% ? 10% ?" which makes me shake my head in disbelief. How could I possibly run a business with that level of dissatisfaction? 50,000 customers every 90 days equates to 1000-5000 complaints every 90 days what a joke!If the complaint level in my business was .002%-.010% I would be mortified. No wonder he can waste so much time on rebuttals - that must be his only job - and he must have a team of people assisting him to dissuade people from asking for refunds.
Anyway, I have a business to run so I won't waste any more time on young James (I say young because of the atrocious spelling and grammar and lack of business acumen) and just so you know James I have been in sales longer than you have been walking so I do understand how to treat customers ethically. Keep up the good work Patrick. Sincere sympathy James - one day you will understand.

Hi Patrick I have been following your comments to James about Great Cars and Trucks and think you have been most civil and logical. However your opinion differs from that of James so he no longer wishes to reply to you - there is James' way or James' way and no possible other way. He has also sinbinned me for the same reason. I guess you and I just don't understand that a business (Great Cars and Trucks) will promise to refund your hard earned money if your item doesn't sell after 90 days. However if you try to accept this kind offer you will need a degree in small print in order to effectively claim your refund. If you overpay Great Cars and Trucks you will have to fight tooth and nail to get YOUR MONEY back.
James makes the comment "What percentage of people complain in any business? 2% ? 10% ?" which makes me shake my head in disbelief. How could I possibly run a business with that level of dissatisfaction? 50,000 customers every 90 days equates to 1000-5000 complaints every 90 days what a joke!If the complaint level in my business was .002%-.010% I would be mortified. No wonder he can waste so much time on rebuttals - that must be his only job - and he must have a team of people assisting him to dissuade people from asking for refunds.
Anyway, I have a business to run so I won't waste any more time on young James (I say young because of the atrocious spelling and grammar and lack of business acumen) and just so you know James I have been in sales longer than you have been walking so I do understand how to treat customers ethically. Keep up the good work Patrick. Sincere sympathy James - one day you will understand.

You want to know what my point is? My point is that Adam was refunded money that he was OVERCHARGED, let me say that again, OVERCHARGED, for his ONE ad. This refund has nothing to do with the 90 day guarantee. You are comparing apples to oranges, and everyone reading this can see that.

And please tell me where I ever said that GC&T does not give refunds for the 90 day guarantee. You can't, because I have never said that. The only time I have mentioned anything about the 90 day guarantee is when I quoted the BBB Reliability Report about GC&T. This post has never been about the 90 day guarantee anyway, so it should not be a topic of conversation on this particular report.

In the first ten Google responses, there are now 2 consumer complaint websites that show up with complaints on GC&T. Keep up the great work!

Dear Patrick;

You clearly point out what I said before that the complaints are all on refund issues. People who did not follow the rules. When you have over 50,000 people on a website right now, you obviously have dealt with a much higher number than that. What percentage of people complain in any business? 2% ? 10% ?

You seem to be stuck on GC&T does not give refunds & now there is proof they do. A refund is a refund... none the less.

I also have pointed out that "some people" rant & rave, & therefore people get tired of talking to them. These are the issues the BBB is speaking of as "unresolved" You cannot please everyone.

These people are "just like you". Someone can claim something & even when it is proven to you... you still balk. You only look for the negative & insult when you have nothing else to say.

Anyone can read this & see my point. I do not need to respond to you anymore. I challenge you to build a business in competition with GC&T if you feel you can do a better job at it. It's a free world. How about putting your money where your mouth is? GC&T has beaten competition in the past. I welcome you to give it a try & see if you can run a better business. I also challenge you to find someone as honest as I am.

Until then... any more post's from you will be ignored by me.

My analogy was a good one, no matter what you say.

So Adam is getting his refund of the over charge. Looks like your conspiracy theory presented in your last post just got blown out of the water.

No, there is no phone number on his ad, but the reply function is active. Maybe there is a reason why he doesn't want his number published.

It seems to me that GC&T surfs the Auto Trader ads to drum up new business. Bad way to prospect for clients if you ask me.

Here's the excerpt from the Canada BBB website regarding GC&T:

"Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record with the Bureau due to failure to respond to one or more complaints and or two or more otherwise unresolved complaints. However the business has resolved most complaints presented to the bureau. refund issues. Consumers are advised to review the company's criteria for refunds on its website at www.greatcarsandtrucks.com "

Hmmm. Failure to respond and unresolved complaints, mostly dealing with refunds. Something is amiss here. Resolved complaints? Yeah, probably based on the BBB's rules that if you reply, no matter how you reply, they will say resolved. Somehow, I highly doubt the complaintants feel the issue was resolved.

I saw you copied and pasted Adam's last post about his getting a refund on another report claiming GC&T does not give refunds. Sorry, but Adam's overcharge refund has nothing to do with someone getting a refund after 90 days if their car does not sell. I will be sure to point that out on that report.

Your continued posts indicate that at least you, if not also GC&T, are slime. I'm sure they appreciate all the negative publicity you are directing towards the business. Keep up the good work.

Adam,

I don't know if you've tried these yet, and I know they are long distance, but try calling:

780-669-2742, or
403-210-2277

I did some browsing of their website. I thought it funny that when I searched the Alberta region for a "2000 Cavalier", and asked to return search results with those exact words, I got a few RVs and 5th wheels. And half the cars were not even put into the proper category. One Cavalier was listed under Trucks & SUVs.

How funny.

I also found your ad. Only found one for you, not 3. Seems to me like GC&T owes you some money back.

Dear Patrick;

As you know, GC&T is not a grocery store & he was not buying beer, but ad space. Now what was the ad space for? He says it was for 1 ad, but was it? Did he place 2 or 3 ad's & expect to pay for only one? Did he have his ad listed in other provinces or states? There is an extra charge for that. We do know:

1> Anyone can call any of the numbers listed on the website & reach someone... so he is incorrect about that.

2> Visa normally will conduct an investigation before they send a customer to fix the problem himself.

3> Within 1 week of not getting a response... most people would have complained to Visa & had them do something about this.

So Adam is not giving us the "true story" here. There is something he is leaving out, & by his attitude it suggests that he merely want's to harrass.

I expect he has been talking to someone at GC&T & they refused his claim for legitimate reasons that Visa agreed with them on. So it is for this reason that he is not taking Johnathan & my advice on the matter. IE: He has already been down this route.

Now you can check the BBB if you want, but if you go into further investigation, you will find that the complaints are from people who "did not" follow the instructions & did not get a refund. You can expect that when you offer a "Money Back Guarantee". All such guarantee's have conditions & people get upset when they do not follow those conditions. However I "personally have seen" people getting their money credited back to them, & so I "personally know" when rules are followed the offer is valid.

However if you are checking... check Adam's Ad. He has no phone # listed on it. Now why would that be? He constantly refuses to list that info here as well. Now who is Adam hiding from & why? How can he sell his car without a phone #?

In closing Patrick... something smells a little fishy here & I do not think it really lies with GC&T's but probably more with Adam who thinks that being abusive will get him ahead, while hiding himself. I am sorry if you cannot see this, but I "personally" am glad to know that we now "in Canada" have a much better way of selling vehicles than being mixed in with dealers, paying $100 or more every 2 weeks... with no financing backing us up. That is more than worth it "in my mind" than to pick on a guarantee that has conditions... which no other publication offers.

I don't know Adam's case because I did not take his ad, nor did I speak to him or know the details of his case. What I do know is that Visa can handle it "much better" than he obviously can & as far as your "beer scenerio" goes, if they refused to credit me at the grocery store... I would not continue to call that store for weeks. I would call Visa. If nothing else, I would feel less of a fool.

Well, Today I received an email from Great Cars and Trucks stating that they have refunded $214 to my credit card. And they apologised for the inconvenience.

While I'm still unhappy that it took three weeks for them to contact me on this issue, I'm nonetheless happy that it did not have to go through the entire Visa "Dispute Resolution" process, which would have taken 4-6 more weeks.

So I have nothing more to say on about this issue.

To those "anonymous" posters who had nothing better to do than trash me, the consumer, because I was unfortunate enough to be accidentally triple-billed by an internet company, all I can say is --- get a real job.

Adam Perceval xxxxx
xxxx(((REDACTED BY Rip-off Report)))
London ON
Canada

(I'm not afraid to identify myself as I have nothing to hide, unlike some people).

Adam said he only posted ONE ad. If that is true, and GC&T overcharged him, then it is GC&T's responsibility to refund the amount, not his CC company.

Here's a good analogy for you. You go to the grocery store to buy groceries and pay with your VISA card. As you're leaving the register, you find out you were overcharged because they rang up your Labatt's Blue twice. What should you do? Tell the cashier of their mistake and ask for a refund, or call VISA and dispute the charges? Of course you would choose the former, not the latter.

Don't you see now how ridiculous your suggestion is? Adam stated he called GC&T and got through once and left a message, along with emails. Why won't GC&T contact him back? If a company overcharged me $214 and refused to contact me back, I would be pissed off too.

And finally, why do you feel the need to post on every single RipOff Report about GC&T? All you're doing is ensuring that at least one RipOff Report shows up in the first 10 entries of a Google search.

PS: I went to the BBB Alberta site, and guess what? That's right, GC&T has an UNSATISFACTORY rating due to unresolved complaints regarding refunds. You have to be pretty d**n bad to earn an unsatisfactory rating with the BBB.

Dear Adam;

If I were an employee of this company, I would not post my phone # so that people "like you" who do not get it, could harrass me. as you seem to be determined to do with GC&T.

If I wanted to decide to refund your money, I would not post some information about that on this website to encourage other people "like you" to think that "harrassment" is the best way of handleing problems. I know that is not good advise to anyone.

I offer you an oppertunity to display however your full name & contact number so that someone could deal with you on this subject without using this medium.

You can "post & post & post" all you like, & I bet you would not get a response from "Sears" in this manner.

Johnathan & I have told you how to rectify your situation. If you instead wish to continue posting... then you are only proving that GT&C has every right not to want to deal with you anymore, but rather than with Visa itself.

What you are doing is futile & is making you look worse & worse with every posting. I know I wish to respond no further with you & I will not. For those who want to read your future postings, I doubt you have anything new to say. Have fun & a good day.

Dear Patrick;

Buddy . As I said before their phone numbers are clearly posted on the website. Call them & see if you do not get through.

Now I don't know what happens in the USA, but here in Canada, other publications are charging close to $100 or more for a 2 week ad with no guantee's & no financing available. On top of that you are only advertized in "one region".

So when a company calls you with benefits over those other companies... they are a viable alternative. Many vehicles do not sell in these other medium's either. However at least this one gives you an oppertunity to get your money back if it does not sell.

Now if it is a Sawmill you are trying to sell... you might not have much success anyway in a car & truck website. However I would not know where else you would put it.

If you read what i said about Adam, I think there might be a chance that he was "not overcharged" or that he was "too abusive" to GC&T. I simply suggested he let Visa handle it.

Obviously "his way" had not worked. Johnathan agreed that it was a good suggestion.

Dear Johnathan;

I did not want to put it in quite the way you did, but I agree with your thoughts on Adam.

Adam sounds like the kind of guy who when is overcharged... goes into the company "Yelling at the top of his lungs"... "Your company is unprofessional & inadequate!". Obviously embarassing all the employees & customers present, quite often getting his money back, even if it is unwarrented... just to alieviate the situation & get rid of him without a further scene.

In this case however, he has no such "soap box" & instead is using the telephone & emails to "rant & rave". Now finally a "rip off report". Most people when confronted by someone like this will ignore them.

Even when I gave him a "clear solution" to his problem... he still goes "on & on" demanding personal satisfaction from the people he has obviously been abuseful towards before to, as they no longer wish to speak to him.

This is "quite obvious" as you point out how abusive he was to me when I was simply trying to show him the proper way of rectifying his problem. His only response to my suggestions so far has been "I called Visa & they told me that you can reverse the charges, but you refuse to". Well let me tell you also that you can call your power company & they can reverse charges on your power bill, but they might also refuse to as well!

Like you said Johnathan... if he let's Visa investigate, they will come up with a fair & unbiased decision without any ranting & raving. Then Adam will have to live with their decision.

However we don't know the whole story do we? Possibly Visa has already investigated & found the charges warrented. Then after Adam screamed at Visa, they told him to take it up with Great Cars and Trucks & then since he hit another brick wall... he is writing rip off reports. That "could be" some of the story we don't know.

Alll I do know is that if he let's Visa handle it & is still not satisfied, then he can quit using Visa for that reason. As with Great Cars and Trucks, I am sure at that point Visa will be glad for that, & wish they never had Adam for a customer in the first place.

You guys just don't get it. If Adam was overcharged, and has made several attempts to contact Great Cars & Trucks to get the situation resolved, then he has done what he needed to do. It is now on GC&T to do the right thing here.

Adam clearly states he has tried several avenues for contacting them (email & phone). James, if you are so "intimate" with this company, why don't you provide a direct line number for Adam to call to get immediate help?

Why must he dispute the charges with his CC company to get the refund? Even then, his refund is not guaranteed as GC&T would probably dispute the charges as valid. There is no reason for him to contact his CC company.

James, what are you? Employee? Indepentdent Contractor? Salesman? What? From all of your posts defending this company, it's hard to tell. And I must say, you are not representing them in a good light. If the guarantee says sold in 90 days or your money back, then customers should be able to get their refund, instead of "You got a great deal for 90 days of advertising, even though your car (or sawmill) didn't sell, so we won't refund your money, even though we advertise sold in 90 days or your money back".

d**n Canadians.

I want to make it clear that I am not responding to anonymous people who are unwilling to list their last name, or who they work for.

I still have not been contacted by Great Cars and Trucks and I will keep posting to this site indefinitely, because that way people will see it when searching for Great Cars and Trucks, and maybe I can save a few people from being burned by this company.

If Great Cars and Trucks wants me to stop posting here, it will need to contact me, admit that they have made a mistake, and refund the $214 that they have taken from me.

if you did not want other people to makes suggestions on how to fix your problem?

All James has done is tried to tell you a way to handle the situation and you;

1. Have determined that he is an employee of the company "First of all, I want to say how offensive it is to me that your company does not answer phone calls or emails and that this is the first response I've had from your company after three weeks of trying.
Second, who exactly is responding to this? Who is "James", what is his last name, and what position does he have in the company?

2. Been a rude and offensive SOB with any suggestion that he has made. I sure would want you as a customer of any business I owned!

Lighten up Francis. And have your meds. corrected when you have the chance, you have a short fuse.

People put responses on ripoffreport to help the consumer who has had a problem. If you didn't want any help or responses, then you should not have filed a ripoffreport.

The correct answer to the problem is just as James has said; leave it up to VISA to investigate. It sometimes takes as long as two weeks for them to settle things, but if you are telling the truth then you will get your money back

Dear Adam;

The company you are speaking of has many phone numbers & could not operate a business efficiently if there was "no way" to contact them.

Now if you feel there is a "fraud" then I would suggest that you suggest this to your Visa company & let them investigate it, as they have more powers than you do.

You suggest they did something illegal, yet for some reason you also do not leave "your full name" or contact information. Have you called the Police?

If Visa charged me for something I did not order & had no proof, as of a swipe of my card or my signature on these charges & they refused to take the charges off... I would not pay that part of my bill, & cancel my credit card. Then I would put my issue with Visa "in writing" & submit that to the Credit Bureau, as I would not want a bad credit rating.

I would then never use that credit card company again. However instead you seem not to be able to get in touch with a company that has all their phone numbers posted on the web. I would have to say that you are better off leaving it up to Visa to investigate, as you have not been very successful. If anyone is reading these letters... try it! Call any of the numbers on the website & see for yourself. Someone answers the phone.

Now I do not know what the "companies side is", however I do know that if you are willing to go to all the trouble to make a "rip off report", you also might have been so abusive to who you spoke to, that they do not wish to respond to you any further. Or someone might have contacted you already finding you unreasonable & so they no longer wish to return your calls. This is why you should allow Visa to do it.

I have ordered things off the internet before. Sometimes I have found charges for things I did not order. I do not try to contact the company who I believe "stole from me", but who charges me for using their service & protects me from such things. That would be Visa. I am sure they can find a phone number for this company & will be able to handle it better than you can. If enough warrented complaints come to Visa because of this company... Visa will take away their billing privilages. They have that power. They also do not need to write "rip off reports".

To sum up... you have not been successful in doing it "your way" & so I am simply suggesting you do it the "right way". I certainly would be a lot faster & less of a headache to you. Also no one else would need to read about your in ability to to follow proper steps (1) Contact Visa & demand an investigation. (2) Make yourself available to testify if Visa finds a fraud. (3) If not satisfied with how Visa handles it... stop using Visa. Use instead a company that will investigate & will involve you in that investigation.

3 rules to live by for the future Adam as what you have done does not work. You have proven it. I doubt writing a "rip off report" about a company makes that company want to spend time working on "your problem". Let it be Visa's problem.

James, If that is your real name, I have no interest in addressing you since you are afraid to identify yourself. Please do not respond to my complaint in the future.

To those others who read this, I just want to make you aware that Great Cars and Trucks has still not responded to any of my emails and does not answer their phone, for a period of almost four (4) weeks now.

If you have a problem with this company, you will certainly get zero (0) customer service, if my experience is typical.

All I am asking is to get my money back for services that I did not receive.

If you go to a department store and buy a product by credit card, and then discover that you were double-billed, you can go to their CUSTOMER SERVICE department and they will immediately credit your account. They do not say "go to your credit card company". That would be incredibly insulting, wouldn't it?

Great Cars and Trucks has $214.00 of my money, unlawfully, and refuses to even speak to me about it.

I am publishing this report for the sole reason of letting other people know that this company is not reputable and if there are any problems with your order, you will get burned.

For the record, Visa IS in fact investigating this issue through a "dispute resolution" process. They have excellent customer service and are even willing to take up the slack when a business refuses to acknowledge that they are illegally in possession of $214 of your money.

Dear Adam;

I am not an employee of the company. I am simply giving you a consumer suggestion. You seem to be biting your nose off to spite your face here & there is no reason for it.

The charges were made to your credit card company. The charges were incorrect. Since the charges that were incorrect are not accompanied by a swipe or your signature, your credit card company is obligated to take those charges off.

Now just because your card company want's to "pass the buck" & try to get you to get a refund from the purchaser, you rant & rave about how you have been put off by "them".

Now I don't know the whole story & there is a chance that you were charged legitimatelly. However if this company had a reputation of doing this on a "constant basis" you should know that credit card companies would not deal with them.

Just try to set up a company that will accept credit cards as payment & see the "hoops involved" as I have. When such problems occur... go to the source. Your credit card company. If your card company is not satisfied that you have been fairly charged, they have the ability to reverse such charges Otherwise they will be in agreement with the company who submitted those charges & refuse your request.

Definately however, your credit card company has more power to deal with this situation than any "rip off report" that you take into your own hands to write because your credit card company has given you the "run around".

I am sure your credit card company is a lot larger than the one you are complaining about & possibly your "rip off report" should be written about them... if you cannot get satisfaction from them. I have used Visa in the past & was able to easily have charges removed from my card that were unwarrented.

First of all, I want to say how offensive it is to me that your company does not answer phone calls or emails and that this is the first response I've had from your company after three weeks of trying.

Second, who exactly is responding to this? Who is "James", what is his last name, and what position does he have in the company?

I called Visa and they stated that you can easily credit back any overbillings to my credit card but you simply refuse to do so. Since Visa has a record of all your transactions, you must have them too.

It would be the absolute minimal customer service if you would simply look at your records for May 11 2005, where you can plainly see that I've been billed three times, and then check my account on your server, where you can plainly see that I have only one advertisement.

So I would like to know what exactly is the problem here?

I've done many online transactions with other companies, and this is the first time that I have not been able to reach a company by phone or email, and not received a response with 24 hours.

It is certainly the first time that I've had to post a nasty note online in order to get a response.

I suppose other users of your service should just post notices on the Rip-off Report, instead of trying to call or email you, since it will get a faster response?

P.S. I encourage you to respond with your full name and company address, as otherwise I'm not convinced that you are an employee of the company.

Dear Adam;

I would advise you to call your credit card company & tell them that you did not make those extra charges. Unless your signature was involved, or a "swipe" of your card... they should be able to remove unwarrented charges.

Usually this company does not make mistakes like that, but it does happen from time to time with any business. Your credit card company is the one that made charges to your account without your authorization. They are responsibe to take the charges off.