PNC Mortgage National City Mortgage Frauding Consumers and Frauding the Government Dayton, Ohio

I have been having issues with PNC, albeit not as extreme as those posted, but in my research I came upon some information about a possible class action lawsuit regarding their HAMP practices. I'm not sure if it is still current, but I thought I would provide the link for those who may be interested. (((link redacted)))

The post is dated Jan. 26, 2011 and you must scroll down to the bottom of the page to read the statement. The law firm is called Strange and Carpenter and their contact info is provided. They are looking for people with stories like the ones I've read on this post. Hope this helps.

 CLICK here to see why Rip-off Report, as a matter of policy, deleted either a phone number, link or e-mail address from this Report.

Again, this is not a rebuttal, just a comment/update.

Doodlebugger--I was told that the attorney's fees will go away when/if you are approved either in-house or through HAMP. I find this hard to believe. Worst case scenario, the fees will be folded into your modified mortgage and you'll pay them as you pay the mortgage. Can you just send your money to PNC to get caught up and then let them handle cancelling the foreclosure?

As for us, we've been approved through HAMP...for now. We're currently in the process of making our 3 trial payments in May, June and July. They refused to cancel the foreclosure sale, which is set for August 11. They said once they receive the 2nd trial payment (June), they will send out the modification agreement and it will need to be signed and returned, at which time the foreclosure sale will be cancelled. We're going to take the package along with any requested documents to our attorney and have her send them in such a way that they can't deny receiving them. I'm sure none of this will happen quickly enough to avoid having our names and address plastered all over the local newspapers in the foreclosure section. My 90yo grandparents will love seeing that. :(

Doodlebugger--continue with what PNC is requesting of you, even as aggravating as it is. Here is the lady whom we dealt with on the Escalation Team...maybe e-mail her to see if she can get things moving, preferably in your favor. "heather.hamman@pncmortgage.com" Her name is Heather Hamman out of the Miamisburg, OH office. Good luck.

My husband and I filed bankruptcy chapter 7 in 2005, and National City refused to reaffirm our loan, but allowed us to continue making payments and said that we could choose to refinance down the road, or if things got worse, we could walk away.  After PNC took over, things went about the same way.  Last June, we ran into some financial difficulties due to medical issues and my husband's job making adjustments between departments.  We called PNC to ask what our options were.  We were advised by more than one representative, to be considered for HAMP, we had to stop making payments. So we did.

We stayed in contact with PNC on a weekly basis, sending in the requested paperwork (hardship papers/HAMP applications/etc.).  We were denied HAMP based on our debt to income ratio.  We were advised to be considered for an in-house modification, we should not make payments.  We were assured on several occasions by different representatives that foreclosure would not take place until we had exhausted our options for modification.

Well, that was a lie because before our in-house mod was even denied, we received foreclosure papers!  We requested to be able to catch up our payments at that point, but the "law office" that was assigned to us wanted more than $4000 in "legal fees" but there was no break down of the fees.  After just having settled a lawsuit in my area recently, I know that the filing fees, and the other fees do not even come close to $4000.  As a matter of fact, the "law office" must be charging $800-$1000 an hour for their services....because the fees that are involved in the court costs are less than $500. 

We contacted PNC and told them that because of their misinformation or rather, their lies, we refuse to pay the legal fees.  At this point, our financial situation had improved and we just wanted to reinstate the loan.  They told us that the "law firm" was now in charge of our reinstatement.  But, repeated phone messages and emails to get information was unsuccessful. 

I can't count how many times we have called PNC at this point, not to mention filing a complaint with the office of the comptroller, emailing the executive or whatever team that is supposed to deal with escalated issues, leaving messages for supervisors, and being told that there would be a foreclosure review started on our loan, and so much more......same answer every time - can you please fill out another hardship letter??  I have lost count on those as well.  Our response - if we don't qualify for HAMP due to debt to income ratio, and we don't qualify for other options because we didn't reaffirm our BK7, and we can't get a reinstatement letter from the "law office" because they won't respond, and you can't get anyone to respond to our emails and phone messages.....really - what other choice is there??  I am more than happy to keep postponing this because at least I don't have to pay PNC my money, but I'm getting worried at how many people have been going through this same situation for over 3 years!!!  Why isn't the government getting involved?  Why isn't there a class action lawsuit??  

I can't afford an attorney, or I likely would have hired one by now.  I'm tired of waiting for a foreclosure sale date, and I am tired of trying to fix things with PNC.  But, because of the foreclosure, we will likely not be able to buy another house for 3 years, and we cannot even find a rental house in our area.  We have the money to catch up payments, but not to pay legal fees.  PNC doesn't care!!!

So, like the rest of you, we will send in yet another hardship letter.....and within a few months we will get the same answer....we don't qualify.  I don't know what else to do.......

I simply wanted to leave a comment, I'm not rebutting anything...not sure why it comes up "rebuttal".

Aggravated...you're just getting started, I feel sorry for you for the amount of time that this will be dragged out for you. I hope I'm wrong, but just be prepared for the battle. Our contact person is supposed to be a Waleska something, but my calls to her were never returned either.

We've been going through all this since early 2009, so we're into our 3rd year now. We were approved in 2009 for a modification, at around $200 less/month than our original payment. Perfect! We were very satisfied. We made those payments on time every month for around 5-6 months, even though the trial period was 3 months while they put together the modification package. We never received the modification package, only a letter threatening foreclosure. WHAT?!

We found out later that the real reason for us being kicked off the modification was overwritten and that the new reason stated "documents not received". Um, sure, okay. Something is fishy, somewhere.

So we've been going back and forth, back and forth with requests for documents, we fax them, request for more documents, we fax them, on and on. We have the Loss Mitigation department contacting us via phone, we have the Foreclosure department contacting us via phone, and we've recently started dealing with something called the Escalation Team...so now my phone is blowing up 5-6 times a day with phone calls from all 3 departments all requesting the same thing.

The last Loss Mitigation person I actually answered the phone for simply wanted to know what we planned to do about our mortgage....I said Excuse Me? Three days ago I faxed all requested information, AGAIN. THEN he decided to check our file and sure enough, there was everything they needed to do yet another review. So I asked why did he call me if he had what he needed?? He didn't have an immediate answer, so I hung up on him.

I've started ignoring the phone calls and instead e-mailing a specific member of the Escalation Team. On 3/16/12 we faxed the latest round of requested documents, so we are waiting to see what happens now. We have, in the meantime, contacted an attorney and are filing an answer through the courts in response to the latest visit from our local sheriff's department. She is also filing a counter-suit for failing to hold up their end of the bargain....mostly just to grab their attention, as we're not expecting a cash payout or anything of the sort. We are paying her $650 of our hard-earned money that we can ill-afford, but we are desperate for help. We are expecting a child in August and would like to have his issue resolved in order to move forward with our lives. We have no desire to abandon our home, but I completely understand the thousands of people who do...and worst of all, feel like they have no choice BUT to leave their home. It's such a sad situation for everyone.

We get assistance with food stamps, so they tell us that since my husband is the sole owner of the loan that his gross income, as well as the food stamps and whatever amount I contribute to the household from my paychecks will all be added together for the sum of our monthly income. For personal reasons, I cannot contribute the whole of my income to the household, so they requested a letter from me stating the amount I DO contribute. NOW they are saying they will use my entire gross income instead of only the amount that I actually help pay, unless I want to submit documentation as to WHY I cannot contribute my whole income. I have no desire to do that, and quite frankly, it's none of their business. I am not named on the deed nor the mortgage, so I am now questioning the discrepancy in who-said-what while still faxing them the information they request.

When we went to one of those mortgage sessions where they have representatives from multiple mortgage companies to help people who are behind on their loans, we were told that the amount of a modification is 31% of a household's monthly income. If that amount turns out to be too low to be satisfactory to the "investors", they have a few other options available...though I can't remember exactly at this point what those options are, but I do remember that none of them suited us. We were there in November of 2011, and here we still are trying to get a modified loan.

At any rate, our attorney told us that our story is one of thousands she's heard in the last 4-5 years. Some people are filing bankruptcy (because their credit is already shot) and in that instance, they can pay $100/month to settle the past-due balance as well as make their regular monthly mortgage payments. That is not possible for us, as we had difficulty with our payment to begin with, which is why we requested help way back 3 years ago.

Five mortgage companies recently settled with the federal government regarding bad and fraudulent loan practices, and the people who were foreclosed upon will end up with a $2000 check for their troubles. PNC was NOT one of those banks who settled. And when it comes down to it, what is $2000 compared to losing your home to BAD business practices and doing everything you can to correct things, only to lose your home anyway?

So the game rages on, and the ball is now in PNC's court in our case. I guess we'll see what tomorrow's e-mail will request of us. Good luck to everyone, we could all sure use it.

We had our home equity loan through Regions bank. It only took a month to get approved for MHAP and our payment was lowered to around $200. On the other hand PNC is doing the same thing to us that is being done to the rest of you.

The request for documents is every 72 hours. We started in April of 2011 and just received our letter stating we did not provide documentation. The letter didn't even state what was missing, just that we didn't send any documentation. We have only spoken to our rep about 2 times. We call him and get his voice mail and he never returns our calls. I am so fed up with PNC!!

 My husband and I are both disabled and we receive SS and a small pension. PNC also required more detailed documents than Regions. Regions only asked for a 4506T and 2 months of banking statements. PNC wanted the last 2 years tax returns including all worksheets (ours was 27 pages long) award letters, bank statements for the last 2 months, plus the RMA and the financial worksheet.  Even after sending tax returns they wanted a signed 4506T. They wanted our bank statements to be highlighted where our SS and pension was direct deposited. They wanted blood!!! We put our loan # on every page plus our names and we numbered them so they could know which papers go with who when they are faxed together along with the rest of the country also sending in their documents.

 
I am considering going to the press since we have a PNC bank here. My husband has a brain tumor, advanced Parkinson's disease, severe diabetes, heart disease and he just got out of the hospital today for his heart and pneumonia, which by the way is what generally kills most Parkinson's patients due to inability to move around much.

I would love to hear from someone about what avenues are available to us. I tried to find a number for PNC's President....I believe his name is E. Todd Chamberlain. Does anyone have Jordan C. as their rep?

Apparantely he doesn't want his last name out there. Help would be greatly appreciated!!

I'm sorry to hear about your situation. I just felt I had to chime in to tell you something really quick. The term you should be using is "defrauding" not "frauding". You might want to look "frauding" up on urban dictionary (dot com) and you'll see what I mean.

I am pretty much in the exact situation Reported By: Virginia Troy Ohio USA at the top of this page.

This situation has been going on since April of 2008 and it's not Dec of 2011 and they have still not resolved anything.

PNC has lost 9 out of the last 10 or my hardship papers or found something wrong with them, when there is clearly nothing wrong with any of them. i even got on the phone with a rep who stated that he had 3 complete workout packets in front of him and didn't understand why nobody was working on them. he then told to fill out another hardship online (the 7th completed hardship) and he would get back with me in 20min...well he never got back with me and after i called back, i was told that they had never received any of my last 7 hardship papers. i even went downtown to talk with somebody, but i was told i couldn't, however they could assist me in filling out another worthless hardship paper...which I did (tenth hardship paper).

i was only 1 week late in April of 2008 and they have drawn this out till now (Nov of 2011).. I have filled out a ridiculous amount of hardship papers for nothing and they worst part is that i never actually had a hardship issue. seems this is their way to drag this affair on as long as possible. they once offered me to catch up with some ridiculous payment plan a year ago, but i refused..even after i refused they show that i agreed to it. they say everything is my fault, even though i have been trying to get them to accept a payment for three years now.

since i was a week late, they put that payment and the next 3 payments into a "suspense" account. they then called me at the end of the 4th month and stated that they have not received payments from me in several months. i had to go to national city bank to find out where my money was going because national city mortgage didn't know. well after quite a while, the people at national city bank were getting frustrated because they couldn't get the national city mortgage people to talk with them over the phone to find out where my payments were. The manager of the bank had to speak with a manager at national city mortgage and give them two special codes he had written on a piece of paper so that they would release the information to national city bank. the national city mortgage people finally released the information, but were really rude and disrespectful to the rep at national city bank while giving out the info. like we were pulling teeth or something. after i learned that my last several payments were in a "suspense" account, they then told me that i would have to file a hardship (which is what started all this mess) and that it would take 10 weeks to go over the hardship and get back with me. i explained that that would make me another couple months late on may mortgage since i can't pay because it would just go into that suspense account. they told me there was no other choice and that they would be filing for foreclosure during this time.

basically i was late one week one time and even though it was well within the grace period they started the foreclosure process. they have since filed for foreclosure two separate times with two separate sheriffs sale dates, both with just went in the trash since PNC never followed up to complete the foreclosure on either of them. i have been contacted by many lawyers stating that they know all about PNC and it's horrible practices, but i think i would just rather move then try to stay in this house...unless i can get it for free. These people have destroyed my credit, lowering my score to the point where i can't even a car loan.

they have recently sent me a 2nd 3 month payment trial packet for possible modification again (you know, the packets where they ask you to pay far more than the original payments). this one is a bit lower and i have paid the last two months on it, but i wondering if i should bother to pay the last month on it or just go rent to own one of the many other nice homes around me.

John
I would like to speak with you. Apologies for the tardiness of the reply. I can be reached at (((Redacted))). i hope entering the number in this fashion will not prompt a redaction.


CLICK here to see why Rip-off Report, as a matter of policy, deleted either a phone number, link or e-mail address from this Report.

I am beginning to wonder if the problem isn't so much the banks, but the MHAP and other loan modifications and the difficulties of all that, when you consider how these loans were securitized.

Regardless, keep us updated if you find a resolution. I really can't offer any other help, unfortunately.

I would like to talk to you. I hope Ripoff will forward your info. to me.

thanks John

In short, this is a partial chronology of our attempt to save our home. We are good, hard working people with an income loss due to medical issues. Our home went from having $40k in equity to being $11k underwater. We have never defaulted on a financial obligation in 30 years.

Feb. 2009: applied for HAMP modification
March 2009: Request was sent from servicer for documentation.
June 2009: Servicer sent letter stating no loss mitigation options available.
Sometime in 2nd half of 2009: Our servicer was bought by another bank using TARP funds.
August 2009: We were accepted into the HAMP trial Program by the new servicer (with the same documentation we were rejected with in June 2009).
We were told to miss a payment to get behind on the loan.
Oct. 2009 March 2010: Made HAMP Trial payments.
Jan. 2010: Servicer requested resubmittal of documentation.
May 2010: Servicer requested resubmittal of documentation.
April 2010: Requested forbearance to have surgery. Servicer refused.
April 2010: Servicer sent letter stating we were an ineligible borrower. The letter contained incorrect information as to financial documentation we submitted.
April 19 2010: Servicer sent a check for $629.77 with letter stating this amount was insufficient to reinstate our loan from default. Efforts to find out why we were considered in default were unsuccessful.
April 27 2010: Servicer sent letter stating we were in default of our loan.
June 23 2010: Servicer sent letter stating we were being referred for foreclosure.
June 23 2010: Foreclosure filed on our home.
July 2010: Servicer sent letter requesting resubmittal of financial documentation.
July 2010: Servicer sent request for resubmittal of documentation.
July 2010: Servicer sent request for resubmittal of documentation.
All these requests were for documentation the servicer had in their possession and was the same documentation we were first accepted for, and then rejected for HAMP.
July 28 2010 Request our complete file from the servicer.
August - October 2010: We succeeded in having the foreclosure reversed, and all fees and penalties waived.
October 2010: Received a modification offer from the servicer. It was at an interest rate far above the current market, and a monthly payment hundreds of dollars over what a market loan would be. We sent a letter outlining these concerns. The offer was rescinded by the servicer four days later.
November 2010: Requested forbearance on loan to schedule surgery. No definitive decision available as of this time.
November 2010: A new modification offer was sent. It was a carbon copy of the offer sent in October. The offer contained a short deadline for acceptance (Thanksgiving day).

The servicer has misinformed, stonewalled, falsified documents, falsified the time of receipt of documents, failed to inform of refinance options, and delayed processing of documents and requests for information.

We could save our home if we could get a loan at current market rates and payments...PNC Mortgage refuses to do this.

If anyone in Az. or Ca. has a similar story, tell it here and we can figure out how to network for a possible class action.

This company NCMC/PNC is doing the same thing to us. Two year nightmare full of deceit, circling around and getting no where. I was drawn to the comment about 'getting even'. sad there is no way to get a hold of this person. we are considering CH13, the tactics they use are a direct contribution to our hardship, they won't talk to us until we are behind in payments, then they collect over $150 in late fees for two years, they won't take a payment unless we agree to a re payment plan with pre charged late fees and totals well over $1,600 more per month than we can already not afford. our credit is shot. the audit of this mortgage is full of violation, trying to get to arbitration is impossible, our home is our place of business, we owned it prior to dealing with NCNC/PNC. Now we're near retirement and nearly homeless. Anyone with legal help against these frauds, please---

my wife and i have had this same problem.

if anyone wants to contact us and leave your number we will call you back..

we are not selling anything we have some legal information that may help you get out of this mess.

you may call and leave your number at

(((ROR redacted)))

we got a lawyer working on this for us and he said we will probably get our house for free,as per a supreme court ruling in July of this year..a presedience has been set already through the supreme court.

this in NOT an add for anything but information that you can take to your lawyer and yes when we call you back you can record the conversation so that you wont forget the facts that we learned from our lawyer.

the above number is my majick jack number so it always goes to voice mail and sends it directly to my email so you will get a return call from us..

like i mentioned above we are not selling anything in any way. we are just homeowners like you are that dont want to get ripped off any longer.

thanks

ken